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Author Topic: Y commoners no make lunch  (Read 978 times)
TardyClock
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« on: April 28, 2012, 12:45:19 PM »

Okay so lets assume that 10 in all stats is the default, then assume that a regular level 1 person how invested maximum skill points into craft cooking.

This person cannot cook a common meal.

Ever.

I use this as my example as to how the crafting DCs are excessively high for an awful lot of things.
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Sletchman
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« Reply #1 on: April 28, 2012, 12:58:08 PM »

Something I mentioned in your last thread, that I feel is worth bring up again again (because it's super important):

PCs =/= NPCs.

This game isn't D&D, where "commoners" share levels in a single (and fairly shitty) class.  They are built with the NPC system to the specifics of their job - so you have Craftsmen, Priests, Bankers, Guardsmen, Barkeeps and so on.  Not just "Commoners".  They're on page 244 if you want to see all of them.

Now: a commoner Craftsman, with Crafting VII has a +8 to Craft checks.  This covers Common meals, as well as Filling and Comfort food (along with animal food and alcohol).

PCs will not have straight 10s, so that assumption is a little flawed, and if the PC wants have Int as a dump stat then they shouldn't be surprised that they are crappy at Intelligence based skills.  That said, I agree that a Common meal has too high a complexity (I run it at 5D, same as Comfort food).
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foproy
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« Reply #2 on: April 28, 2012, 01:02:53 PM »

but then all the character needs is crafting 4 to make it. it is not a check to cook, it is just matching the complexity to your level + skill. so a tl5 commoner only needs a +4 to make the meal + 3 if they have a 12 int.
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TardyClock
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« Reply #3 on: April 28, 2012, 01:10:40 PM »

Well that got shut down pretty fast. Nevermind then.

I still feel however that it takes a rather long time for a character to reach the level at which they can really craft much of anything. It just seems that unless you invest very heavily into crafting witht eh feats and such that it barely seems worth it.

Oh and what bonuses do you actually get for using a workshop? I keep finding references to how great they are but not what they actually do.

Edit: Found it now, nevermind.
« Last Edit: April 28, 2012, 01:13:36 PM by TardyClock » Logged
Gentry
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« Reply #4 on: April 28, 2012, 01:18:29 PM »

I still feel however that it takes a rather long time for a character to reach the level at which they can really craft much of anything. It just seems that unless you invest very heavily into crafting with the feats and such that it barely seems worth it.

Well, yeah. As with anything, if you want to be good at it you need to invest mechanical resources to make it so. The more you invest, the better at it you get.
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foproy
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« Reply #5 on: April 28, 2012, 01:18:53 PM »

at level 3 and only max ranks in craft Alden my character in the burnt offerings game can craft up to a 9 complexity. which covers most basic weapons excluding firearms, and any armor with any one upgrade on it. with 2 he can do most. also that is with a 10 int.
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SilvercatMoonpaw
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« Reply #6 on: April 28, 2012, 01:23:18 PM »

Could make sense, if you think about stereotypical "starving peasant" image.
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foproy
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« Reply #7 on: April 28, 2012, 01:24:41 PM »

also didnt most peasants eat gruel and porridge when at home?
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SilvercatMoonpaw
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« Reply #8 on: April 28, 2012, 01:26:17 PM »

Taking another look at it I don't think "Common Meal" means "stuff normal, everyday people eat to survive".  I think it means "cheap restaurant meal".  Comfort Food and Rations sound more like what most people eat.
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pawsplay
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« Reply #9 on: May 30, 2012, 11:14:39 PM »

Okay so lets assume that 10 in all stats is the default, then assume that a regular level 1 person how invested maximum skill points into craft cooking.

This person cannot cook a common meal.

Ever.

I use this as my example as to how the crafting DCs are excessively high for an awful lot of things.

Actually, assuming the commoner is an NPC, Crafting VI is entirely sufficient even at first level. Or Crafting III and BSM (Trader). Or you could give the commoner a level of Veteran. Assuming the NPC has Crafting as a signature skill at all, it should be a cinch. Note that making gruel, or mac-and-cheese, is not a demonstration of the Crafting skill.
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LordKruelos
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« Reply #10 on: May 31, 2012, 08:09:23 AM »

All of this kinda begs the question of "Why would you ever roll a commoner NPC's action for a mundane, common, non-dramatic, non-plot-related task?"
If it's just to test the bounds of the system, then like Sletchman already pointed out, PCs =/= NPCs.

That, and I can't imagine the Complexity of pottage being even as high as 5, when all you're doing is essentially cutting up veggies (not even specific ones -- really just whatever you have available), throwing them in a pot with water (or stock if you're particularly lucky). Boil, then simmer until veggies are cooked (or, usually, over cooked), then add oats or something else to thicken it.
« Last Edit: May 31, 2012, 08:11:39 AM by LordKruelos » Logged
glimmerrat
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« Reply #11 on: June 07, 2012, 12:45:34 PM »

Take 10 or Take 20.

/thread
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