Question concerning Copper and emotional allomancy

[Cen]

Copper provides protection from brass and zinc allomancy by subtracting dice from an aggressor/attackers dice pool.

My questioned is in regards to when this subtraction takes place durring a conflit. Is it:

A: when you first calculate your action dice.
 or
B: when you form a pool (to make a mental attack).

Im thinking its the former but it is unclear in the book.

[Crafty_Alex]

Welcome to the boards!

In this case, I would do this when you form a pool. That way, your action dice are only affected when you choose to go after the copper allomancer.

[Cen]

Welcome to the boards!

In this case, I would do this when you form a pool. That way, your action dice are only affected when you choose to go after the copper allomancer.

Hi Alex, thanks for the warm welcome.

Im still a little confused. If my declared action was to preform a mental attack on a Smoker would that not effect my action dice generation? I would have to "go after" him as my declared action in the first place in order to produce the action dice.

Also, I can see a problem with having the subtraction take place when you create the pool. With the limit of ten dice in any conflict pool would that not render any cooper burner with 9 or more dots (or 7 and the improved emotional allomancy resistance stunt) immune to any emotional allomancy even from an extremely potent soother or rioter (say one with a base 7 and a 5 spike)? Or can you "front load" you conflict pool with more then 10 dice then preform the subtraction? Like is the example above say I have 13 action dice (12 from an enhanced Brass score and an appropriate trait) and I want to attack a Cooper misting with a 6. Could I put all 13 dice into a pool then remove the 6 and make my mental attack with 7 dice?
If this is the case would it not be easier to preform the subtraction when you first form up your action dice and then recalculate the pool like normal if you take an action other then the declaired attack?

Thank you for your consideration, I appreciate it.

[ReaderAt2046]

Also, I can see a problem with having the subtraction take place when you create the pool. With the limit of ten dice in any conflict pool would that not render any cooper burner with 9 or more dots (or 7 and the improved emotional allomancy resistance stunt) immune to any emotional allomancy even from an extremely potent soother or rioter (say one with a base 7 and a 5 spike)? Or can you "front load" you conflict pool with more then 10 dice then preform the subtraction? Like is the example above say I have 13 action dice (12 from an enhanced Brass score and an appropriate trait) and I want to attack a Cooper misting with a 6. Could I put all 13 dice into a pool then remove the 6 and make my mental attack with 7 dice?
If this is the case would it not be easier to preform the subtraction when you first form up your action dice and then recalculate the pool like normal if you take an action other then the declaired attack?

Thank you for your consideration, I appreciate it.

Good idea!

[Dreamstreamer]

With the limit of ten dice in any conflict pool would that not render any cooper burner with 9 or more dots (or 7 and the improved emotional allomancy resistance stunt) immune to any emotional allomancy even from an extremely potent soother or rioter (say one with a base 7 and a 5 spike)?

Sure does! A copper rating of nine is incredibly powerful at resisting allomantic influence and hiding from Seekers. That's their schtick.

Or can you "front load" you conflict pool with more then 10 dice then preform the subtraction? Like is the example above say I have 13 action dice (12 from an enhanced Brass score and an appropriate trait) and I want to attack a Cooper misting with a 6. Could I put all 13 dice into a pool then remove the 6 and make my mental attack with 7 dice?

In this case, the extra dice are converted into Nudges (see "Pools Above Ten Dice" on page 142). The Brass user would roll four dice and have three bonus Nudges on a success.

[Cen]

In this case, the extra dice are converted into Nudges (see "Pools Above Ten Dice" on page 142). The Brass user would roll four dice and have three bonus Nudges on a success.

I believe that is true of contests but not of conflicts. Its not spelled out 100% in the rule book but I have read on the forum that you can not create a conflict pool with more then ten dice to net automatic bonus nudges. This topic (conflict pools over 10 dice) was discussed in the tread Lets talk about feruchemists: http://www.crafty-games.com/forum/index.php?topic=5938.0

[Dreamstreamer]

I believe that is true of contests but not of conflicts. Its not spelled out 100% in the rule book but I have read on the forum that you can not create a conflict pool with more then ten dice to net automatic bonus nudges.

Sorry for the delay, Cen.

On page 138, 'Each roll is made with 2 to 10 dice, otherwise known as your "pool."'
On page 142, 'The largest any pool can ever be is 10 dice. If your pool ever grows above 10 dice, it remains at 10 dice and you gain 1 "free" Nudge for each die beyond 10."

The bold is mine. I don't see any differentiation being made between pool types (contest vs. conflict) in the rules. I believe the forum thread you mention concludes with a rule change for Feruchemists tapping Pewterminds, but I believe that the ruling was an exception specific to that situation and not a general rule.

Hope this helps!