Threat range and spells

[Theodoran]

Hello,

I have a little question. I cast a spell, that isn't an attack spell but make damage (like magic missile). My spellcasting check is in the threat range. Can I make a critical hit or only use threat range for keep my spellpoints.

Thank you yet for your help ,
 

[Sletchman]

By the rules you can only inflict a critical hit with a damaging spell if it is an Attack spell.  So for non-attack spells (Cause Wounds, Magic Missile, etc) you can only regain your spellpoints used to cast it.  Hope that helps, and welcome to the forums.

[Theodoran]

Thank you for your answer. That's help me. But I thought that cause wound was consider as an attack spell when the target tried to avoid the contact. It's not the case?

Nice to meet you

[Krensky]

Attack spells have a range line of: Whatever attack. The Cause Wounds line just says Touch, so it's not an attack. If you sucessfully cast it, you touch your target.

[Sletchman]

Thank you for your answer. That's help me. But I thought that cause wound was consider as an attack spell when the target tried to avoid the contact. It's not the case?

Sorry, my bad (wasn't thinking with that example).  You're totally right, if the target tries to avoid contact with a spell with a range of Touch the casting check has to exceed their defence.

[Theodoran]

So, it's possible to make a critical hit with cause wound...or not?

Thank you for all your answer, it's a nice forum

[Crafty_Alex]

So, it's possible to make a critical hit with cause wound...or not?

Thank you for all your answer, it's a nice forum

No it is not possible to inflict a critical hit with Cause Wounds because it requires no attack roll.

[Sletchman]

So, it's possible to make a critical hit with cause wound...or not?

Thank you for all your answer, it's a nice forum

No it is not possible to inflict a critical hit with Cause Wounds because it requires no attack roll.

If that's the case you might wanna flag page 112 for clarification in the next errata document.

When a spell is used to attack, either as part of the spell description (e.g. “long range attack”) or due to the situation (e.g. the target tries to avoid a “touch” spell), the Spellcasting result is also the attack result.

The bit I bolded really suggests that the case is otherwise.  I'm not saying you're wrong, just that the book could do with being more explicit in this case.  Plus this text will likely exist in Spellbound, as will a whole slew of extra touch spells - so if the text gets fixed before that book is finalised it's a twofer.

[Coyote0273]

So, it's possible to make a critical hit with cause wound...or not?

Thank you for all your answer, it's a nice forum

No it is not possible to inflict a critical hit with Cause Wounds because it requires no attack roll.

If that's the case you might wanna flag page 112 for clarification in the next errata document.

When a spell is used to attack, either as part of the spell description (e.g. “long range attack”) or due to the situation (e.g. the target tries to avoid a “touch” spell), the Spellcasting result is also the attack result.

The bit I bolded really suggests that the case is otherwise.  I'm not saying you're wrong, just that the book could do with being more explicit in this case.  Plus this text will likely exist in Spellbound, as will a whole slew of extra touch spells - so if the text gets fixed before that book is finalised it's a twofer.

I second this.

It doesn't seem right, though, that Touch of Frost a level 0 spell can crit and kill a mook and Magic Missile can't.

[magustoad]

Cause wounds is a bit wonky in a few ways:  It's a pseudo-attack you have to roll over defense (and have to stand in harms way for touch range), can't crit for dmg, is a full action cast, does kinda poopy damage, has a save for half roll, and to top it off, is subject to damage reduction.  Buuhh?

My group has been scratching its collective head over it for some time.  As we read it; it is inferior in every. way. possible. to its contemporaries.  Are we missing something?

[Crafty_Alex]

Cause wounds is a bit wonky in a few ways:  It's a pseudo-attack you have to roll over defense (and have to stand in harms way for touch range), can't crit for dmg, is a full action cast, does kinda poopy damage, has a save for half roll, and to top it off, is subject to damage reduction.  Buuhh?

My group has been scratching its collective head over it for some time.  As we read it; it is inferior in every. way. possible. to its contemporaries.  Are we missing something?

Specialist mages may not find it so bad when they don't have access to all 888 spells in the system...

[magustoad]

Specialist mages may not find it so bad when they don't have access to all 888 spells in the system...

Actually our Reaper has cast it exactly once, then figured out it was better to use weapons as they, also, generally surpass the spell pretty much every way possible.  It drives him loony because he wants to use his spells, but so far the guy all about death magic is a better melee'r. 

The spell just needs something, divine dmg perhaps?  Of course then the latter spells get nutso.  Shorter casting time?  Longer range?  Drop the save?  Make it a straight-up attack spell with all privileges thereof?

The devil seems to be in the progression of the line, fixing the first rank could scale up to zomg proportions when at later ranks.  Divine dmg mass cause? >.< Ouchies.  Even removing the save for half makes me take pause at that level.

It is an unfortunate oddity we are still mulling over at our table.

[Fenn Grunberg]

Hi,
I'm a little puzzled: Why magic missile isn't considered as an Attack Spell  ? It has a Range, the Caster must roll a skill check, and, of course, it causes damages: what am I missing?
Thanks a lot!

[Krensky]

It's replicating the D&D version's auto hit feature. Any spell caster worth his salt will hit a DC of 16 without raising a sweat.

[TheTSKoala]

Cause wounds is a bit wonky in a few ways:  It's a pseudo-attack you have to roll over defense (and have to stand in harms way for touch range), can't crit for dmg, is a full action cast, does kinda poopy damage, has a save for half roll, and to top it off, is subject to damage reduction.  Buuhh?

My group has been scratching its collective head over it for some time.  As we read it; it is inferior in every. way. possible. to its contemporaries.  Are we missing something?

Specialist mages may not find it so bad when they don't have access to all 888 spells in the system...

*throws the yellow flag*  Product Teasing.  Number 88 on Crafty Team.  15 DC penalty.  Automatic.. QQ!