Firarms in a near future setting

[Maldroth]

Hello all I posted a topic a while back about the cyberpunk genre and got some excellent feedback on how to handle most of the gear and cyberware but now there is one more thing to ask.

How would you handle new firearms for a near future game?

At first glance it would seem logical to move some equipment to lower caliber picks and put the new stuff in a higher pick but where should one draw the line? Some staples will still be used, look at the AK-47 for instance designed long ago its still widly used today and probably will 25 years from now, however most edgerunners will want to run with the latest and greatest.

How should I change the gear pick tables to accomidate?

[Aragathor]

look at the AK-47 for instance designed long ago its still widly used today and probably will 25 years from now

Not really, technology goes forward and the venerable ak-47 will one day become obsolete.
Truth to be told, most weapons that look like it aren't it (the AK-108 looks almost like the AK-47).

Right now if we look into the future of firearms we see new calibers being introduced, new lightweight materials, smart-links and so on...

[Gatac]

I recommend you introduce new gear properly scaled to what's already there, then use the Big Budget campaign quality.

Gatac

[Crafty_Alex]

In Shatterpunk, I've held to my standard thoughts when it comes to weapons and tech:

1) While tech features spike quickly, once a technology stabilizes, it plateaus. In the case of weapons, some of the most effective weapons/calibers are OLD - the 1911 (now nearly 100 years old), the AK-47 (60), 9mmP (at least 85), .45 ACP (well over 100), 7.62 (80). These guns/calibers aren't going anywhere soon, because they already do the job so well there's not much reason to change them.

2) That said, I still expect feature creep to move forward. Modern weapons are often heavy, their recoils high, and so on and so forth. I expect that future weapons would start by improving what we have to make the best weapon possible. Most gov'ts know how lethal they want their guns - that's why the 5.56 has been used since the 60's. But you still see all sorts of weapons development to make the M4 even better, more rugged, more reliable...THAT'S where I see weapon development going in near future games.

[Maldroth]

So you pretty much think that the tables should stay the same and you just have more/new options added to it.

I have been watching Futureweapons on Discovery for some ideas on weapon advancement, been rather enlightening to see where things are going, alot of it seems to be modifications to existing concepts such as better delivery of existing calibers/ammunition.

[Crafty_Pat]

One thing to remember is that Spycraft design shuns power creep, so weapon stats would not be significantly better. The guiding philosophy behind this part of the system is that technology generally advances various facets of play at roughly parallel speeds. So while weapons might be "better," so would medicine, conditioning, body training and modification, and other matters of physical health. So what we might do with a lot of near future settings, and even some future ones, would be to move the *names* of weapons down the Caliber scale, replacing the highest ones with new *names*, but keep the actual stats intact.

[Mister Andersen]

Maybe the easiest option would to be to give every item an additional free upgrade

[Crafty_Pat]

Maybe the easiest option would to be to give every item an additional free upgrade

See my most recent post again. That's pretty obviously power creep, albeit on a small scale.

[Maldroth]

Perfect Pat that's the feedback I needed. Still new to Spycraft and didn't have anything to compare how things have been done.

So in essence it really comes down to flavor, the names of the weapons on the table are flavor, while older weapons didn't really get weaker even though the stats would indicate so the rules factor in the same general improvements in body armor and training to compensate.

That's exactly what I needed

[Crafty_Pat]

Perfect Pat that's the feedback I needed. Still new to Spycraft and didn't have anything to compare how things have been done.

So in essence it really comes down to flavor, the names of the weapons on the table are flavor, while older weapons didn't really get weaker even though the stats would indicate so the rules factor in the same general improvements in body armor and training to compensate.

That's exactly what I needed

Awesome. Glad I could help.

[Psion]

So what we might do with a lot of near future settings, and even some future ones, would be to move the *names* of weapons down the Caliber scale, replacing the highest ones with new *names*, but keep the actual stats intact.

Hmmm. I was sort of viewing the near future version of the "big budget" quality as the means to do this while leaving the tables the same. Add new, slick weapons and put them in the appropriate place on the table and let the increased calibers represent the better availability of guns (or whatever other sort of tech you want to purchase.)

[Antilles]

Say, have you seen This is my rifle... yet? A slew of fancy high-tech guns, which I wouldn't be suprised were still around 25 years from now.

[agent oni]

One thing to remember is that Spycraft design shuns power creep, so weapon stats would not be significantly better. The guiding philosophy behind this part of the system is that technology generally advances various facets of play at roughly parallel speeds. So while weapons might be "better," so would medicine, conditioning, body training and modification, and other matters of physical health. So what we might do with a lot of near future settings, and even some future ones, would be to move the *names* of weapons down the Caliber scale, replacing the highest ones with new *names*, but keep the actual stats intact.

Out of curiosity, where would  "Bag full of Guns" fall in?  I had thought that power creep would have occurred with that expansion.

[Crafty_Pat]

Out of curiosity, where would  "Bag full of Guns" fall in?  I had thought that power creep would have occurred with that expansion.

We're working quite hard to not make that the case. Owners of the products will notice that the weapons included are merely different, not more powerful.

[afrodave]

RSA AKS-74U-UBN: (a more modern version of the original AK-47)
comes with TBR (thredded barrel), CLS (collapsable stock), and UPG (removable silencer)
Give the Advanced combat sight (rail), Clockwork action, Custom Grip, Sling Tactical, Lasersight multi-mode (underbarrel), Reworked Action, Ruggedizing, and Precision upgrades.
This is a standard Caliber III weapon, upgraded fora  Caliber V mission, with the bonus from Big Budget. Think this is whiz enough for your average Street Samurai, chummer?