The Gift and Menacing Threat

[Bhurano]

Hi there,

while creating a potential character, I stumbled across "The Gift". It states that up the INT modifier spells are known for such a char and that these spells can be used as often per scene as the starting dice. The question came up because I had the combination gifted human mystic mage in mind.

So how interacts this with a mage? I would say that a mage treats these spells as normal spells or should the description of the feat be used?

So what's your take on that one?

On another note. A human mage with ruthlessness and sorcerer can threaten up to 3 people and the would have to save against 14 + 1/2 stress damage taken. Did I read that correct? I mean, it sounds like bottled doom for any standard character. Hey, It would be damn cool to go around as a whizzie staring people into oblivion. Would give the whole subtle and qick to anger angle a whole new meaning.

And since I'm already here. I'm pondering to create a feat named "Wraith of Faerie" which would give Fae creatures the "Menacing Threat" quality. Would that be ok, or might problems arise. It would fit perfectly in the background of our campaign world... but I'm a bit reluctant to introduce elements that are created by me or others... better safe than sorry on that one.

As always thanks for your opinions in advance.

[Golden Dragon]

On the first question, Mage with the Gift, that would be a question for the GM. How does he want it to work at the table. I see either solution (Spells from the Gift have their own rules or treat them as normal spells) working.

As for the Ruthless Sorcerer, the combination of menacing threat and terrifying look received some debate. A Rules Lawyer (raises hand) will point out that standard NPCs do not make Will saves against stress damage, and those do not receive a +4 to the save DC. A respected authority (Pat the game designer) said that he would apply the +4 save DC to standard NPCs at his table.

As for Fury of the Fairie, go see the license to improvise forum. There is a point system for putting abilities in origins (which should add up to seven points) and that same point system can be used for building feats. (I cannot recall what the total for feats was. I think 3 pts, but that could easily be wrong.)

As for building your own stuff, you are to be commended for not wanting to tinker with it without understanding. But, it is a toolkit, and it needs to be applied in a way that works for the game at your table. Some design, as well as some pruning, will be necessary. And those other games are always creating new rules, new feats, new classes, new monsters, new spells.... You get the idea.

[Coyote0273]

For the Sorcerer, I agree with Golden Dragon, same with creating the feat. I'd suggest getting used to the game before you tinker with the rules at all, as it might already work how you want it without changing anything.

For the Mage/The Gift, that's simple. The spells gained by the feat, work exactly like the feat. They can be used X times per scene , but they don't cost spell points and don't require a spellcasting check.. His other spells will cost spell points and be used however often he can cast them. But, in this case, he wouldn't be able to cast them as often as he wants.

The Gift represents 'inante abilities'. It would be like an old school drow wizard. He can either cast globe of darkness off his spell list if he knows it, or use his special once per day ability and automatically do it.

[LordKruelos]

As for Fury of the Fairie, go see the license to improvise forum. There is a point system for putting abilities in origins (which should add up to seven points) and that same point system can be used for building feats. (I cannot recall what the total for feats was. I think 3 pts, but that could easily be wrong.)

If I were to take a stab at it, this is how I'd do it:

New Species Feat
Aspect of the Wild
When roused, your wrath is a terrible splendor to behold.
Prerequisites: Saurian or Fey, Glint of Madness
Your Appearance bonus increases by +1.
You gain the Menacing Threat NPC quality and may target up to 3 opponents with each Threaten action. Each opponent rolls to resist separately.

As for the Ruthless Sorcerer, the combination of menacing threat and terrifying look received some debate. A Rules Lawyer (raises hand) will point out that standard NPCs do not make Will saves against stress damage, and those do not receive a +4 to the save DC. A respected authority (Pat the game designer) said that he would apply the +4 save DC to standard NPCs at his table.

(As the rules lawyer for the opposing side  ) I can say that allowing the +4 to the save DC for Standard NPCs has in no way shape or form unbalanced my game, and to me it's counter-intuitive for minions to be less susceptible to threatening than their bosses. But whatever works for your game and makes you and your players happy, go with that.

Of course, considering that my PCs may sometimes go several sessions without confronting a Special NPC, I wasn't going to nerf a PC ability that was closely related to a character concept regardless of if a game designer weighed in or not.

[Krensky]

That's 4 points, which is heavy for a first tier species feat. If memory serves, those are 2.5 to 3 points, so Menacing Threat by itself would probably fill the feat out by itself.

[Mister Andersen]

It's a 2nd tier feat

[Krensky]

It's a 2nd tier feat

Yes it is, my mistake. I missed Glint of Madness there.

[LordKruelos]

It's a 2nd tier feat

That's how I'd do it at least -- most likely anyone who's going to go this route is going to get Glint of Madness anyway, so forcing it as a prerequisite didn't seem unfair to me. Otherwise, kill the Appearance bonus and the prerequisite feat and you're probably fine, but it seems like a less enjoyable feat that way.

[Golden Dragon]

Let me add that menacing threat is powerful at level 1. Forcing three standard NPCs to make damage saves which they have close to a 50% chance of failing, is quite a powerful option. (I haven't played this at higher levels to see how the power curve diminishes.)

[Mister Andersen]

Aspect of the Wyld
     When in your element, you are a terrible splendor to behold.
     Prerequisites: Unearthly Splendor, Survival 4+ ranks, Appearance 2+
     Benefit: Choose a terrain type: when in that terrain, you may apply your Appearance bonus to Intimidate and Survival checks. You also gain a stance.
     Wyld Aspect Stance (Stance): Any character other than your teammates who sees you suffers a morale penalty with Resolve checks and Will saves equal to your Appearance. However, any errors you roll while in this stance require 1 less action die to confirm and you may not take free actions.

[LordKruelos]

Aspect of the Wyld
     When in your element, you are a terrible splendor to behold.
     Prerequisites: Unearthly Splendor, Survival 4+ ranks, Appearance 2+
     Benefit: Choose a terrain type: when in that terrain, you may apply your Appearance bonus to Intimidate and Survival checks. You also gain a stance.
     Wyld Aspect Stance (Stance): Any character other than your teammates who sees you suffers a morale penalty with Resolve checks and Will saves equal to your Appearance. However, any errors you roll while in this stance require 1 less action die to confirm and you may not take free actions.

I like

Making it a stance makes perfect sense.

[Alien Rope Burn]

Let me add that menacing threat is powerful at level 1. Forcing three standard NPCs to make damage saves which they have close to a 50% chance of failing, is quite a powerful option. (I haven't played this at higher levels to see how the power curve diminishes.)

Having a PC in my TT game with Menacing Threat + Glint of Madness, plus the ability to drop Intimidate as a free action now and then, it's icing on the cake but not devastating. It generally weakens enemies but rarely takes them out with their higher saves at high levels. But then, my group had a Captain who can give everybody Contempt since an early level and now drops extra attacks like candy, so my perception of the utility of a standard-busting mechanism may be a little skewed.

[Bhurano]

Hi there,

sorry for responding so late... had no time to that, sorry.

Your responses are great... and I think I take both of the feats you created (which by the way are awesome ) and use them as a chained variant.

Unfortunately we had no possibility to play this weekend , but my char is planned and ready to go.

So I have to wait to see how this setup works out in a game. My only fear is, that the char might lack spellcasting feats and so many enemies will make their saves.

Thanks for your help guys.