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Author Topic: [Fantasy Craft] Class Conversion Exercise - Warlock  (Read 4350 times)
paddyfool
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« Reply #15 on: March 17, 2011, 10:39:06 AM »

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Does all of that make sense?

Yes, I can see where you're coming from with this.

A couple of specific points, though:

Quote
3) As for CON vs. INT, this was not specifically intentional, but a function of the choice of a Skill to base the "casting roll" on. The only skill that truly made sense, if one was not going to grant "spellcasting" was Resolve, which just happens to be a CON skill.  Do I feel this unbalanced? Not really. Again, the Warlock wasn't meant to be just another Mage that used INT/WIS/CHA and the choice of Resolve just happened to reinforce that, making the Warlock a more hybrid feeling CON/CHA/DEX based class instead.

I don't feel this is unbalanced either, but if you wanted to make it a different stat, you could always say Resolve (Str/Dex/Int/Cha/Wis), since you can change the stat that modifies any given skill for specific applications.  However, Con makes as much sense as anything here, so you needn't worry.  (The one thing I don't see is how this class specifically benefits from DEX; it seems to be all CHA & CON).

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As for the auto-success, I believe only Assassin gets Resolve as an option. Even then, if you take a dip into Assassin 1 to get this, you only gain auto-success on spell DC's under 21, which is auto-success on level 0 to level 2 spells only.  The only real issue I see with this (since the core alternative is to make them act like Divine spells, which means being auto-success anyway) is Eldritch Blast. However, I've already made a change to Eldritch Blast, making it's base "Spell Level" increase with class level.

Yes, this shouldn't really be a problem unless a player wants to get the magic item which grants that class ability (as if they were a level 4 Assassin), in which case you can simply tell them no.  I also find it a little funny how Pechs become particularly good Warlocks, but that's not a big deal.

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The progression is based on Paths, not Circle of Power. If you based it on CoP you would get a more restricted gain of spells at a given level but in trade would get 9th level spells. Following Paths, you get a slight boost in the spell level you can access at a lower level but you can only ever get up to 8th level spells.

I see, but I still think 1,2,3,4 would be a more even progression; and since you have 9 stages of advancement to implement rather than 5, there's no real need to be bound by the Path progression imho.  Unless the real concern is that you simply don't want access to the highest level spells.  (Although as your selection and spells known will be more limited, the Warlock still won't be quite competing with the Mage on this ground).

One more question: how are you costing spellcasting for the Warlock?  Do they use spellpoints, as the Mage, or something else?
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Krensky
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« Reply #16 on: March 17, 2011, 11:59:11 AM »

The problem with using Resolve is that it's a skill. More precisely it's in the Skill chapter.

That means that the Skill chain effects it. Flawless skills. Double boost. etc.
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SilvercatMoonpaw
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« Reply #17 on: March 17, 2011, 12:28:51 PM »

A new "Warlocking" (note: just an example name) skill could be created that functioned similar to "Spellcasting" regarding the skill rules but for Warlock-type stuff.
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Morgenstern
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« Reply #18 on: March 17, 2011, 03:56:29 PM »

Could call it "Bargaining " Smiley.

I'd really like ot see the pact specific infromation pull OUT of the class listing and put all in one place. So Angelic would indicate

ANGELIC PACT
Damage Type: Divine
Feat line: Angelic Heritage, Angelic Legacy
19th Level Ability: Blah
Ability Choices:
Blah 1
Blah 2
Blah 3
Spell List
Level 0
Level 1
Level 2
Level etc...

Present all of the pacts that way so you can actually see what a pact gives you rather than bouncing up and down through the class and supporting text Smiley. Slim the clas down to what's true of all pacts, and pointers to what part of the pact info you're getting or pickign from at each level.
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Khaalis
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« Reply #19 on: March 18, 2011, 01:57:21 AM »

Wow. Thanks for the very constructive input. Some really good comments here.

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@ paddyfool
1) I did NOT know that you could specifically go and change the associated Attribute on an existing skill for a specific use. That is an incredibly important design function to note for the future!

2) As to DEX, it was a holdover from the original draft which had BAB Medium and REF low, and Eldritch Blast being a “ranged attack”. However, most of the reasoning still holds true in that a decent DEX is still good for boosting REF save, Initiative and Defense, as well as number of the class’ skills (a really good use of your tertiary stat for this class).  However, with the expected changes, it will end up looking more like a CHA/DEX/CON lineup for Favored Attributes.

3) On Spell Level Progression… I see your point, but I’m still truly torn.  The path progression was a holdover from the 1st draft where I was originally thinking to make Warlock Paths. The problem turned out to be I felt they were simply TOO restrictive for spell access and I would have had to write dozens of them to fit all of the Pacts. A simple restricted spell list was much more fitting to the concept in the end.  

It was also done to mimic the “levels” of Invocations: Lesser, Intermediate, Greater and Superior. By doing it at a 1 Spell Level increment, you have to drop this “spell category” mechanic.

However, that still leaves the question of whether or not they should get access to 9th level spells. Granted as you note, the Warlock will only know 2 9th level spells at 19th level, but I’m still worried that it steps too much on the Mage’s (and its subsequent specialist classes’ toes). Personally, I like the 8th level spell limit, but I’m willing to negotiate and will likely go to 9th level spells.  Smiley

So it would end up looking like this.

      Invocations: You gain the ability to cast advanced invocations.  At Levels 3, 5, 7, 9, 11, 13, 15, 17 and 19 you gain 2 additional invocations from your Pact spell list. The level of spell you may choose is based upon your Class Level as follows.
•   Level 3 may choose up to Level 1 spells.
•   Level 5 may choose up to Level 2 spells.
•   Level 7 may choose up to Level 3 spells.
•   Level 9 may choose up to Level 4 spells.
•   Level 11 may choose up to Level 5 spells.
•   Level 13 may choose up to Level 6 spells.
•   Level 15 may choose up to Level 7 spells.
•   Level 17 may choose up to Level 8 spells.
•   Level 19 may choose up to Level 9 spells.
   Level 1 and higher invocation spells may only be cast once per scene each. You may learn the same spell more than once however, allowing for multiple castings per scene of that spell.


4) Costing of the spellcasting for the warlock is the same as Path casters. 0-Level spells may be cast at-will and each other spell acquired may be cast once per scene (unless you take the same spell twice, granting you that spell 2/scene).


Quote
@ Morgenstern:
I'd really like ot see the pact specific infromation pull OUT of the class listing and put all in one place. So Angelic would indicate
I had seriously debated this topic. I know that a lot of people can go either way, some wanting to see the options for that ability listed right where they are reading rather than referencing a different location, and others who want to be able to see the whole “theme” in one place. I do however, tend to agree with you overall, and will make this format change.


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@ SilvercatMoonpaw / Morgenstern
On the new skill, that’s a really good idea. I was afraid to tread on that ground as the Spellcasting skill seemed to be somewhat sacred design territory. However, since it has been suggested…

This requires a number of changes. So here we go…

   Favored Attributes: Charisma, Dexterity, Constitution

   Forceful Caster: Each time you spend 1 action die to boost a Bargaining check to cast a spell, you roll and add the results of 2 dice (e.g. at Career Level 1, 1d4 becomes 2d4).

   Warlock Pact: You choose to make a pact with other-worldly entity in exchange for the ability to cast invocations, which are innate arcane spell-like abilities granted to you through your pact. At Level 1, you may purchase ranks in the Bargaining Skill and choose 2 Level 0 spells of your choice from your Pact’s spell list. These Level 0 invocation spells may be cast at will. Additionally, you gain the Eldritch Blast invocation for your pact (see Sidebar) that you may cast at-will.

   Destructive Blast: At Level 14, your threat range with Bargaining checks to cast Eldritch Blast increases by 4. Also, when your Eldritch Blast invocation would kill a character, they cannot Cheat Death (see FC p384).


BARGAINING (CHA)
Warlocks can spend skill points to purchase ranks in the Bargaining skill, which is only available to characters with a Casting Level of 1 or higher. Bargaining operates like any other skill.
   Knowledge: Warlock Pacts; casting techniques; magical nature of pact entities; species knowledge of your pact's species
   Special: Bargaining is interchangeable with the Spellcasting skill in regards to Spellcasting feats, and acts exactly as the Spellcasting skill in regards to “Attack Spells” and “Spell Defense”.

BARGAINING (Varies)
A warlock makes this check to cast invocations he knows. Each warlock may make only 1 Bargaining check per round and he must be able to speak aloud to do so.  Bargaining is an obvious action and clearly visible to anyone with line of sight to the warlock; to conceal an attempt, the warlock must also make a Prestidigitation check opposed by Notice.
   To make a Bargaining check, the warlock spends the allotted casting time + any additional casting time required for tricks and other effects and compares his result to the DC listed on Table: Bargaining Checks (see below). With success, the invocation is cast and its effect occurs. With failure, the invocation is not cast and has no effect (a sentient target feels a hostile force or tingle but cannot deduce the nature or origin of the sensation). A failed check does not count as a use of the invocation for that scene.
   With a critical success, the warlock does not expend the use of the cast invocation for that scene if it is a limited use per scene invocation. If it is an at-will use invocation (and not an Attack Spell [FC p112]), the warlock may choose one of the following effects:
   •   Reduce casting time to 1 Free Action.
   •   Double the spell’s Area if not Personal or Touch.
   •   Double 1 numeric benefit from the spell’s effect.
   (e.g. A critical success when casting Expeditious Retreat would allow the warlock to cast it as a Free Action, increase the Duration to 2 minutes or increase the speed boost to +40ft.)
   With a critical failure, his confidence is shaken and he suffers a –5 penalty with Bargaining checks until he succeeds with a Bargaining check or until the end of the current scene, whichever comes first.

Table: Bargaining Checks
Spell
Level   DC

0      14
1      17
2      20
3      23
4      26
5      29
6      32
7      35
8      38
?9?      41

Note: I made this 1 point higher than spellcasting to make it a little harder and to differentiate it from spellcasting. Good idea or just say "Same as Spellcasting"?



Thoughts.
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Khaalis
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« Reply #20 on: March 18, 2011, 03:58:09 AM »

REVISION 2

Warlock: Wielders of forbidden magical lore gained through pacts with powerful other-worldly powers.

WARLOCK
Warlocks channel arcane might wrested from primeval entities. They commune with infernal intelligences and fey spirits, scour enemies with potent blasts of eldritch power, and bedevil foes with hexing curses. Armed with esoteric secrets and dangerous lore, warlocks are clever and resourceful foes. However you came to your arcane knowledge, you need not accept the poor reputation warlocks sometimes endure. The pacts are complete. The rites have concluded. The signs are drawn in blood, and the seals are broken. Your destiny beckons.
   Depending on your campaign, a Warlock could be…
   •   A libram-toting scholar captivated by ominous lore
   •   A foot-loose wanderer with a knack for the elements, searching for elusive ultimate truths
   •   A devil-touched hunter using infernal spells to eliminate evil
   •   A black-clad mercenary of the fey courts who uses sinister trappings to discourage prying strangers and unwanted attention
   •   A true diabolist using your gifts to tyrannize the weak
   •   A crusader of the light fighting the forces of evil

      Party Role: Combatant/Wildcard. You are always prepared to defend yourself with eldritch power, but the rest of your talents depend upon your warlock pact and the powers granted by it.


CLASS FEATURES
   Requirement: Sorcery campaign quality
   Favored Attributes: Wisdom, Charisma, Dexterity, Constitution
   Caster:  Each level in this class increases your Casting Level by 1.
   Class Skills: Athletics, Bluff, Crafting, Disguise, Intimidate, Notice, Resolve, Sense Motive, Survival, Pact Skill
   Skill Points: 6+INTmod
   Vitality: 9+CONmod
   Starting Proficiencies: 4

BAB: Medium
FORT: Low

REF: Medium
WILL: Medium
DEF: Medium
Init: High
Life: Medium
Leg: Medium


1. Warlock Pact, Forceful Caster
2. Pact Revealed I
3. Invocations
4. Bonus Feat
5. Invocations
6. Pact Boon
7. Invocations
8. Bonus Feat
9. Invocations, Pact Boon
10. Warlock Curse (+1d6)
11. Pact Revealed II, Invocations
12. Bonus Feat, Pact Boon
13. Invocations
14. Destructive Blast
15. Invocations, Pact Boon
16. Bonus Feat
17. Invocations
18. Pact Boon
19. Pact Revealed III, Invocations
20. Bonus Feat, Warlock Curse (+2d6)


CORE ABILITY
      Forceful Caster: Each time you spend 1 action die to boost an Invoking check to cast a spell, you roll and add the results of 2 dice (e.g. at Career Level 1, 1d4 becomes 2d4).


CLASS ABILITIES
      Warlock Pact: You choose to make a pact with other-worldly entity in exchange for the ability to cast invocations, which are innate arcane spell-like abilities granted to you through your pact. At Level 1, you may purchase ranks in the Invoking Skill and choose 2 Level 0 spells of your choice from your Pact’s spell list. These Level 0 invocation spells may be cast at will. Additionally, you gain the Eldritch Blast invocation for your pact that you may cast at-will.

   ELDRITCH BLAST
      Level: 1 Invocation
      Casting Time: 1 half action
      Distance: Short Range
      Duration: Instant
      Effect: You release a spray of eldritch energy at a target you can see inflicting 1d6+ your Charisma modifier damage of a type based on your Pact. This attack is considered a both a spell and bow attack for feat applications. The effective level of your Eldritch Blast increases as your Class Level increases. At Level 3, 6, 9, 12, 15 and 18, the effective spell level of your Eldritch Blast increases by 1.


      Pact Revealed I: The power of your pact becomes ingrained in your being. At Level 2, you gain the Pact Revealed I ability as listed in your pact.
      Pact Revealed II: The power of your pact becomes more integral to your being. At Level 11, you gain the Pact Revealed II ability as listed in your pact.
      Pact Revealed III: The power of your pact becomes an iconic part of your being. At Level 19, you gain the Pact Revealed III ability as listed in your pact.

      Invocations: You gain the ability to cast advanced invocations.  At Levels 3, 5, 7, 9, 11, 13, 15, 17 and 19 you gain 2 additional invocations from your Pact spell list. The level of spell you may choose is based upon your Class Level as follows.
•   Level 3 may choose up to Level 1 spells.
•   Level 5 may choose up to Level 2 spells.
•   Level 7 may choose up to Level 3 spells.
•   Level 9 may choose up to Level 4 spells.
•   Level 11 may choose up to Level 5 spells.
•   Level 13 may choose up to Level 6 spells.
•   Level 15 may choose up to Level 7 spells.
•   Level 17 may choose up to Level 8 spells.
•   Level 19 may choose up to Level 9 spells.
   Level 1 and higher invocation spells may only be cast once per scene each. You may learn the same spell more than once however, allowing for multiple castings per scene of that spell.

      Bonus Feat: At Levels 4, 8, 12, 16, and 20, you gain 1 Basic Combat or Spellcasting feat.

      Pact Boon: At Levels 6, 9, 12, 15, and 18, you may choose one of the Pact Boon abilities from your pact. Each of these abilities may be chosen only once.  

      Warlock Curse: At Level 10, once per round as a free action, you can place a Warlock Curse on an enemy in Short Range that you can see. A cursed enemy is more vulnerable to your attacks. If you damage a cursed enemy, you deal 1d6 additional damage. You decide whether to apply the extra damage after making the damage roll. You can deal this extra damage once per round.
   A Warlock’s Curse remains in effect until the end of the encounter or until the cursed enemy is unconscious or dead.
   You can place a Warlock’s Curse on multiple targets over the course of an encounter; each curse requires the use of a free action. You can’t place a Warlock Curse on a creature that is already affected by your or another character’s Warlock Curse.
   At Level 20, your additional damage increases to 2d6.

      Destructive Blast: At Level 14, your threat range with Invoking checks to cast Eldritch Blast increases by 4. Also, when your Eldritch Blast invocation would kill a character, they cannot Cheat Death (see FC p384).


« Last Edit: March 21, 2011, 02:26:33 AM by Khaalis » Logged
Khaalis
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« Reply #21 on: March 18, 2011, 04:06:38 AM »

REVISION 2 - PART 2

WARLOCK PACTS

ANGELIC PACT
•   Pact Skill: Medicine
•   Eldritch Blast Damage Type: Divine damage
•   Pact Revealed I: You gain the Angelic Heritage feat.
•   Pact Revealed II: You gain the Angelic Legacy feat.
•   Pact Revealed III: The lower of your Wisdom or Charisma scores rises by 1, your Acid and Cold Resistance increases to 15. If you previously chose, or choose to grow feathered wings, you no longer suffer any associated penalties to action dice for doing so.
•   Pact Boon Choices:
   o   Always Ready: You may always act during surprise rounds.
   o   Blessings: The error ranges of checks made by allies within Close Quarters decrease by 1 (minimum 1).
   o   Channeling the Pact: Once per session as a 1-minute action, you may choose 1 NPC quality from the following choices that lasts until the end-of the scene: Attractive II; Damage Reduction 1; Darkvision I; Devoted (Good I, Light I or Order I); Honorable; Regeneration 1; Spell Defense I; Telepathic
   o   Empowered Blast: You’re a conduit of eldritch energy. When attacking with your Eldritch Blast, you benefit from the Angry Hornet and Bullseye feats.
   o   Expertise: Taking 10 with your Pact Skill doesn’t take twice as long and taking 20 takes only 10 times as long.
   o   Forceful Blast:  It costs you 1 fewer action dice to activate a critical hit against with your Eldritch Blast (minimum 0).
   o   Rebuke: You’re an instrument of eldritch devotion. Characters you successfully Turn also suffer an amount of damage equal to your Resolve bonus. This extra damage is of the same damage type as your Eldritch Blast.  Those targeted who make their Will saves suffer half this damage (rounded down). You may only choose this ability if you may Turn.
   o   Sterling Reputation: When you or your allies lose Reputation, the loss decreases by 2 (minimum 0).
   o   Turning: Once per combat you may Turn (see FC p223) characters of 1 Type from the following list (chosen at the time you gain this ability): elemental, fey, horror, outsider, spirit, or undead.
   o   Watched Over: Once per adventure as a free action, you may gain a free Blessing favor with a cost equal to your Class Level + 5. Unless used, this Favor is lost at the end of the scene.
•   Pact Invocations:
   o   Level 0: Create Water, Detect Alignment, Feather Fall, Glow I, Magic Vestment I, Touch of Light
   o   Level 1: Bless, Call from Beyond I, Command I, Cure Wounds I, Divine Favor, Insight, Protection from Alignment
   o   Level 2: Align Weapon, Calm Emotions, Consecrate, Cure Wounds II, Restoration I, Righteous Aura, Shield Other
   o   Level 3: Call from Beyond II, Cure Wounds III, Fly I, Glow II, Heroism I, Lift Curse I, Magic Vestment II, Neutralize Poison, Prayer, Tongues I, Zone of Truth
   o   Level 4: Castigate I, Cure Wounds IV, Detect Lies, Devotion Hammer, Divine Power, Restoration II
   o   Level 5: Call from Beyond III, Command II, Cure Wounds I – Mass, Fly II, Light’s Grace, Mark of Justice, Resurrection I, True Seeing
   o   Level 6: Cure Wounds II – Mass, Heroes’ Feast, Heroism II, Lift Curse II, Tongues II
   o   Level 7: Call from Beyond IV, Cure Wounds III – Mass, Project Presence, Purge, Regenerate, Resurrection II, Sunlight I
   o   Level 8: Castigate II, Cure Wounds IV – Mass, Mind Blank, Sacred Aura, Sunlight II
   o   Level 9: Call from Beyond V, Heal – Mass, Heroism III, Lift Curse III, Resurrection III, Time Stop


DEVILISH PACT
•   Pact Skill: Sneak
•   Eldritch Blast Damage Type: Fire damage
•   Pact Revealed I: You gain the Devilish Heritage feat.
•   Pact Revealed II: You gain the Devilish Legacy feat.
•   Pact Revealed III: The lower of your Dexterity or Intelligence scores rises by 1, your Fire and Electricity Resistance increases to 15. If you previously chose, or choose to grow bat wings, you no longer suffer any associated penalties to action dice for doing so.
•   Pact Boon Choices:
   o   Always Ready: You may always act during surprise rounds.
   o   Channeling the Pact: Once per session as a 1-minute action, you may choose 1 NPC quality from the following choices that lasts until the end-of the scene: Attractive II; Cagey I; Damage Reduction 1; Darkvision II; Devoted (Curses I); Dread; Grueling Combatant; Menacing Threat; Spell Defense I; Stench; Superior Runner I; Unnerving
   o   Devilish Deflection: When you successfully Taunt an opponent you may force him to attack any character adjacent to you (other than himself). You may use this ability a number of times per scene equal to your starting action dice.
   o   Empowered Blast: You’re a conduit of eldritch energy. When attacking with your Eldritch Blast, you benefit from the Angry Hornet and Bullseye feats.
   o   Expertise: Taking 10 with your Pact Skill doesn’t take twice as long and taking 20 takes only 10 times as long.
   o   Forceful Blast:  It costs you 1 fewer action dice to activate a critical hit against with your Eldritch Blast (minimum 0).
   o   Rebuke: You’re an instrument of eldritch devotion. Characters you successfully Turn also suffer an amount of damage equal to your Resolve bonus. This extra damage is of the same damage type as your Eldritch Blast.  Those targeted who make their Will saves suffer half this damage (rounded down). You may only choose this ability if you may Turn.
   o   Silent Shadow:  When you make a Sneak check, a single adjacent ally or teammate may share your result. The character must remain within 10 ft. of you to retain this benefit.
   o   Sly Threat: The threat ranges of your Influence and Browbeat checks to reduce Disposition increase by your Intelligence modifier (minimum +1).
   o   Turning: Once per combat you may Turn (see FC p223) characters of 1 Type from the following list (chosen at the time you gain this ability): elemental, fey, horror, ooze, outsider, spirit, or undead.
   o   Watch Your Back: Once per adventure as a free action, you may gain a free Harassment favor with a cost equal to your Class Level + 5. Unless used, this Favor is lost at the end of the scene.
•   Pact Invocations:
   o   Level 0: Detect Alignment, Expeditious Retreat, Feather Fall, Flare, Magic Vestment I, Whispers
   o   Level 1: Animate Dead I, Call from Beyond I, Command I, Cause Wounds I, Disguise Self, Protection from Alignment, Scare I
   o   Level 2: Align Weapon, Blur, Cause Wounds II, Darkness I, Dominate Undead I, Insanity I, Scare II, Silence
   o   Level 3: Animate Dead II, Bestow Curse, Call from Beyond II, Cause Wounds III, Fly I, Invisibility, Magic Vestment II, Searing Ray, Speak with the Dead, Tongues I
   o   Level 4: Castigate I, Cause Wounds IV, Detect Lies, Dimension Door, Divine Power, Flawless Fib, Mantle of the Mundane, Phantasmal Killer
   o   Level 5: Animate Dead III, Call from Beyond III, Cause Wounds I – Mass, Command II, Fly II, Insanity II, Power Word: Harm, True Seeing
   o   Level 6: Cause Wounds II – Mass, Harm, Power Word: Recall, Quake Touch, Tongues II
   o   Level 7: Animate Dead IV, Call from Beyond IV, Cause Wounds III – Mass, Dominate Undead II, Finger of Death, Phase Door, Purge, Shadow Walk
   o   Level 8: Castigate II, Cause Wounds IV – Mass, Insanity III, Mind Blank, Power Word: Stun, War Cry
   o   Level 9: Animate Dead V, Call from Beyond V, Power Word – Kill, Time Stop


DRACONIC PACT
•   Pact Skill: Tactics
•   Eldritch Blast Damage Type: Fire damage
•   Pact Revealed I: You gain thick hide 3 and gain Tactics as an origin skill. When taking the Basic Skill Mastery feat you have access to a new skill pair: Conqueror (Impress & Tactics).
•   Pact Revealed II: You gain the Draconic Legacy feat.
•   Pact Revealed III: The higher of your Strength or Intelligence scores rises by 1, and you gain Acid and Fire Resistance 15. If you previously chose, or choose to grow leathery wings, you no longer suffer any associated penalties to action dice for doing so.
•   Pact Boon Choices:
   o   Always Ready: You may always act during surprise rounds.
   o   Channeling the Pact: Once per session as a 1-minute action, you may choose 1 NPC quality from the following choices that lasts until the end-of the scene: Aquatic II; Beguiling; Bright II; Cagey II; Chameleon (1 terrain) I; Charge Attack; Damage Reduction 1; Darkvision I; Fearsome; Ferocity; Improved Senses (Scent or Sight); Improved Stability; Light Sleeper; Menacing Threat; Monstrous Defense I; Never Outnumbered; Regeneration 1; Spell Defense I; Spell Reflection; Swift Attack I; Superior Climber II; Superior Swimmer III
   o   Draconic Speed: In combat, your Speed increases by 10 ft.
   o   Empowered Blast: You’re a conduit of eldritch energy. When attacking with your Eldritch Blast, you benefit from the Angry Hornet and Bullseye feats.
   o   Expertise: Taking 10 with your Pact Skill doesn’t take twice as long and taking 20 takes only 10 times as long.
   o   Forceful Blast:  It costs you 1 fewer action dice to activate a critical hit against with your Eldritch Blast (minimum 0).
   o   Great Hoard: Your maximum Prizes increase by 2.
   o   Hoard Assets: When Coercing, your incentive modifiers are always at least extreme (see Table 2.12: Persuasion and Coercion, page 75).
   o   Hoarded Knowledge: Once per adventure as a free action, you may gain a free Feat Training favor with a cost equal to your Class Level + 5. Unless used, this Favor is lost at the end of the scene.
   o   Hidden in Plain Sight: As a free action, you may make a Stash check to hide 1 object weighing up to 1 lb. Inspection fails to find the object unless a threat or critical success is scored.
   o   Rebuke: You’re an instrument of eldritch devotion. Characters you successfully Turn also suffer an amount of damage equal to your Resolve bonus. This extra damage is of the same damage type as your Eldritch Blast.  Those targeted who make their Will saves suffer half this damage (rounded down). You may only choose this ability if you may Turn.
   o   Turning: Once per combat you may Turn (see FC p223) characters of 1 Type from the following list (chosen at the time you gain this ability): beast, elemental, fey, or undead.
•   Pact Invocations:
   o   Level 0: Detect Secret Doors, Endure Elements, Expeditious Retreat, Feather Fall, Orient Self, Read Magic
   o   Level 1: Alarm, Command I, Detect Magic, Identify I, Insight, Jump, Magic Aura, Scare I, Scrye I
   o   Level 2: Arcane Lock, Brawn I, Detect Emotion, Knock, Locate Object, Mage Armor, Obscure Object, Resist Energy, Scare II, Wit I
   o   Level 3: Counter Magic I, Fly I, Glyph of Protection I, See Invisible, Scrye II, Tiny Shelter, Tongues I
   o   Level 4: Brawn II, Detect Lies, Detect Traps, Resilient Sphere I, Spell Immunity I, Wit II
   o   Level 5: Brawn I – Mass, Command II, Fly II, Scrye III, True Seeing, Wall of Counter Magic, Wit I - Mass
   o   Level 6: Anti-Magic Field I, Brawn III, Glyph of Protection II, Heroes’ Feast, Identify II, Tongues II, Wit III
   o   Level 7: Counter Magic II, Hindsight, Regenerate, Scrye IV
   o   Level 8: Brawn IV, Mind Blank, Pinpoint, Protection from Spells, Resilient Sphere II, Spell Immunity II, War Cry, Wit IV
   o   Level 9: Anti-Magic Field II, Counter Magic III, Scrye V, Time Stop


ELEMENTAL PACT
•   Pact Skill: Acrobatics
•   Eldritch Blast Damage Type: By element as follows
   o   Crystal = lethal (edged) damage
   o   Darkness = flash damage
   o   Dust/Sand = lethal damage
   o   Earth = lethal blunt damage
   o   Fire = fire damage
   o   Ice = cold damage
   o   Lava = heat damage
   o   Light = divine damage
   o   Lightning = electrical damage
   o   Metal = lethal damage
   o   Mist/Smoke = acid damage
   o   Water = lethal (blunt) damage
   o   Wind = force damage
   o   Wood = acid damage
•   Pact Revealed I: You gain the Elemental Heritage feat.
•   Pact Revealed II:  You gain the Elemental Legacy feat.
•   Pact Revealed III: Your highest attribute rises by 1 and your lowest attribute drops by 1. Also, all numerical benefits of your Elemental Heritage feat (positive and negative) are triple the starting amount (i.e. if you have Elemental Heritage (Earth), your Damage Reduction becomes 6/Blunt and your Speed decreases by 15 ft. instead of 5 ft.). If you previously chose, or choose to gain the Elemental Type, you no longer suffer any associated penalties to action dice for doing so.
•   Pact Boon Choices:
   o   Always Ready: You may always act during surprise rounds.
   o   Channeling the Pact: Once per session as a 1-minute action, you may choose 1 NPC quality from the following choices that lasts until the end-of the scene: Battering; Cagey II; Critical Surge; Damage Reduction 1; Darkvision II; Everlasting; Fearsome; Grappler; Grueling Combatant; Improved Stability; Knockback; Monstrous Defense I; Never Outnumbered; Superior Swimmer III; Tricky (Shove)
   o   Elemental Event: Once per adventure as a free action, you may gain a free Diversion favor with a cost equal to your Class Level + 5. Unless used, this Favor is lost at the end of the scene.
   o   Elemental Influence: Each ally and teammate within 10 ft. who can see and hear you gains the benefits of uncanny dodge I. This does not stack with uncanny dodge abilities they already have.
   o   Empowered Blast: You’re a conduit of eldritch energy. When attacking with your Eldritch Blast, you benefit from the Angry Hornet and Bullseye feats.
   o   Evasive: You often trip opponents up with their own attacks. Once per round when an adjacent opponent’s attack misses you by 5 or more, you may immediately attempt to Tire the opponent as a free action. You may substitute Acrobatics in place of Resolve for this action.
   o   Expertise: Taking 10 with your Pact Skill doesn’t take twice as long and taking 20 takes only 10 times as long.
   o   Forceful Blast:  It costs you 1 fewer action dice to activate a critical hit against with your Eldritch Blast (minimum 0).
   o   Rebuke: You’re an instrument of eldritch devotion. Characters you successfully Turn also suffer an amount of damage equal to your Resolve bonus. This extra damage is of the same damage type as your Eldritch Blast.  Those targeted who make their Will saves suffer half this damage (rounded down). You may only choose this ability if you may Turn.
   o   Turning: Once per combat you may Turn (see FC p223) characters of 1 Type from the following list (chosen at the time you gain this ability): construct, elemental, ooze, outsider, or spirit.
   o   Walk this Way!: When you make an Acrobatics check, a single adjacent ally or teammate may share your result. The character must remain within 10 ft. of you to retain this benefit.
•   Pact Invocations:
   o   Level 0: Detect Secret Doors, Endure Elements, Expeditious Retreat, Orient Self, Whispers
      -   Crystal: Dancing Lights, Flare, Glow I
      -   Fire: Flare
      -   Ice: Create Water, Polar Ray I
      -   Light: Dancing Lights, Flare, Glow I, Touch of Light
      -   Water: Create Water, Polar Ray I, Water Walk
      -   Wind: Feather Fall
   o   Level 1: Divine Favor, Entropic Shield, Insight, Shield, Unseen Servant
      -   Crystal: Color Spray, Conjure Elemental I (Earth), Illusionary Image I, Scrye I
      -   Darkness: Conjure Elemental I (Air), Disguise Self, Pass without Trace, Scare I
      -   Dust/Sand: Conjure Elemental I (Air, Earth), Control Weather I, Illusionary Image I, Pass without Trace
      -   Earth: Conjure Elemental I (Earth), Entangle, Jump, Magic Stone, Pass without Trace
      -   Fire: Conjure Elemental I (Fire), Illusionary Image I
      -   Ice: Conjure Elemental I (Air, Water), Control Weather I, Winter’s Domain I
      -   Lava: Conjure Elemental I (Earth, Fire)
      -   Light: Color Spray, Conjure Elemental I (Air), Illusionary Image I
      -   Lightning: Conjure Elemental I (Air), Control Weather I
      -   Metal: Conjure Elemental I (Earth), Magic Weapon I , Shatter, Tinker I
      -   Mist/Smoke: Conjure Elemental I (Air), Disguise Self, Illusionary Image I, Pass without Trace
      -   Water: Conjure Elemental I (Water), Control Weather I, Scrye I
      -   Wind: Conjure Elemental I (Air), Control Weather I, Jump
      -   Wood: Conjure Elemental I (Earth), Entangle, Magic Weapon I, Pass without Trace
   o   Level 2: Blur, Mage Armor, Resist Energy
      -   Crystal: Blindness/Deafness, Illusionary Image II, Mirror Images
      -   Darkness: Blindness/Deafness, Darkness I, Insanity I, Obscure Object, Scare II, Silence
      -   Dust/Sand: Illusionary Image II, Mirror Images, Obscure Object
      -   Earth: Goodberry
      -   Fire: Illusionary Image II, Mirror Images, Scorching Ray
      -   Ice: Chill Storm I, Deadly Draft I, Mirror Images, Silence
      -   Lava: Knock, Scorching Ray
      -   Light: Blindness/Deafness, Illusionary Image II, Mirror Images, Scorching Ray
      -   Lightning: Blindness/Deafness, Silence
      -   Metal: Knock, Tinker II
      -   Mist/Smoke: Darkness I, Illusionary Image II, Mirror Images, Obscure Object
      -   Water: Chill Storm I, Water Walk - Mass
      -   Wind: Chill Storm I, Deadly Draft I, Gust of Wind, Levitate
      -   Wood: Knock
   o   Level 3: See Invisible, Tongues I
      -   Crystal: Confounding Images, Conjure Elemental II (Earth), Glow II, Illusionary Image III, Invisibility, Keen Edge, Scrye II
      -   Darkness: Conjure Elemental II (Air), Darkness II, Fly I, Invisibility
      -   Dust/Sand: Control Weather II, Conjure Elemental II (Air, Earth), Fly I, Illusionary Image III, Invisibility, Wall of Wind
      -   Earth: Conjure Elemental II (Earth)
      -   Fire: Conjure Elemental II (Fire), Fireball I, Fly I, Haste, Illusionary Image III, Invisibility, Searing Ray
      -   Ice: Control Weather II, Conjure Elemental II (Air, Water), Fly I, Wall of Wind
      -   Lava: Conjure Elemental II (Earth, Fire), Fireball I, Searing Ray, Sharp Stone
      -   Light: Confounding Images, Conjure Elemental II (Air), Fly I, Glow II, Haste, Illusionary Image III, Invisibility, Searing Ray
      -   Lightning: Call Lightning I, Control Weather II, Conjure Elemental II (Air), Fly I, Haste
      -   Metal: Conjure Elemental II (Earth), Glyph of Protection I, Keen Edge, Sharp Stone
      -   Mist/Smoke: Conjure Elemental II (Air), Darkness II, Fly I, Illusionary Image III, Invisibility, Wall of Wind
      -   Water: Control Weather II, Conjure Elemental II (Water), Scrye II, Water Breathing
      -   Wind: Control Weather II, Conjure Elemental II (Air), Fly I, Haste, Invisibility, Wall of Wind
      -   Wood: Conjure Elemental II (Earth), Glyph of Protection I, Verdure
   o   Level 4: Dimension Door, Divine Power, Freedom of Movement
      -   Crystal: Illusionary Image IV
      -   Darkness: Phantasmal Killer
      -   Dust/Sand: Air Walk, Elemental Shield (Fire), Illusionary Image IV, Phantasmal Killer
      -   Earth: Detect Traps
      -   Fire: Elemental Shield (Fire), Illusionary Image IV, Wall of Fire
      -   Ice: Chill Storm II, Elemental Shield (Ice), Polar Ray II, Wall of Ice
      -   Lava: Elemental Shield (Fire), Wall of Fire
      -   Light: Illusionary Image IV
      -   Lightning: Lightning Bolt I
      -   Metal: Detect Traps, Magic Weapon II, Rusting Grasp
      -   Mist/Smoke: Air Walk, Illusionary Image IV, Phantasmal Killer
      -   Water: Chill Storm II, Elemental Shield (Ice), Move Water, Polar Ray II, Rusting Grasp
      -   Wind: Air Walk, Chill Storm II, Phantasmal Killer
      -   Wood: Detect Traps, Magic Weapon II
   o   Level 5: Teleport I, True Seeing
      -   Crystal: Conjure Elemental III (Earth), Illusionary Image V, Scrye III
      -   Darkness: Conjure Elemental III (Air), Cloudkill, Fly II, Insanity II
      -   Dust/Sand: Control Weather III, Conjure Elemental III (Air, Earth), Cloudkill, Fly II, Illusionary Image V
      -   Earth: Conjure Elemental III (Earth), Move Earth, Natural Attunement, Wall of Stone
      -   Fire: Conjure Elemental III (Fire), Fly II, Illusionary Image V
      -   Ice: Control Weather III, Conjure Elemental III (Air, Water), Cone of Cold, Fly II, Winter’s Domain II
      -   Lava: Conjure Elemental III (Earth, Fire), Move Earth, Wall of Stone
      -   Light: Conjure Elemental III (Air), Fly II, Illusionary Image V, Light’s Grace
      -   Lightning: Call Lightning II, Control Weather III, Conjure Elemental III (Air), Fly II
      -   Metal: Conjure Elemental III (Earth)
      -   Mist/Smoke: Conjure Elemental III (Air), Cloudkill, Fly II, Illusionary Image V
      -   Water: Control Weather III, Conjure Elemental III (Water), Scrye III
      -   Wind: Control Weather III, Conjure Elemental III (Air), Cloudkill, Fly II
      -   Wood: Conjure Elemental III (Earth), Natural Attunement
   o   Level 6: Disintegrate, Find the Path, Repelling Wave I, Tongues II
      -   Crystal: Blindness/Deafness – Mass, Illusionary Image V
      -   Darkness: Blindness/Deafness – Mass
      -   Dust/Sand: Illusionary Image V
      -   Earth: Quake Touch, Tree Walk
      -   Fire: Illusionary Image V
      -   Lava: Quake Touch
      -   Light: Blindness/Deafness – Mass, Illusionary Image V
      -   Lightning: Blindness/Deafness – Mass, Lightning Bolt II
      -   Mist/Smoke: Illusionary Image V
      -   Wind: Quake Touch
      -   Wood: Tree Walk
   o   Level 7: Hindsight, Phase Door, Teleport II
      -   Crystal: Conjure Elemental IV (Earth), Scrye IV
      -   Darkness: Conjure Elemental IV (Air), Shadow Walk
      -   Dust/Sand: Control Weather IV, Conjure Elemental IV (Air, Earth)
      -   Earth: Conjure Elemental IV (Earth)
      -   Fire: Conjure Elemental IV (Fire), Fireball II
      -   Ice: Control Weather IV, Conjure Elemental IV (Air, Water), Deadly Draft II
      -   Lava: Conjure Elemental IV (Earth, Fire), Fireball II, Fire Storm
      -   Light: Conjure Elemental IV (Air), Shadow Walk, Sunlight I
      -   Lightning: Control Weather IV, Conjure Elemental IV (Air)
      -   Metal: Conjure Elemental IV (Earth)
      -   Mist/Smoke: Conjure Elemental IV (Air), Shadow Walk
      -   Water: Control Weather IV, Conjure Elemental IV (Water), Scrye IV
      -   Wind: Control Weather IV, Conjure Elemental IV (Air), Deadly Draft II
      -   Wood: Conjure Elemental IV (Earth)
   o   Level 8: Maze, Mind Blank, Protection from Spells, Repelling Wave II
      -   Crystal: Illusionary Image V, Invisibility – Mass, Scintillating Pattern
      -   Darkness: Insanity III, Invisibility - Mass
      -   Dust/Sand: Illusionary Image V, Invisibility - Mass
      -   Earth: Earthquake, Iron Body
      -   Fire: Illusionary Image V, Invisibility - Mass
      -   Ice: Polar Ray III
      -   Lava: Earthquake
      -   Light: Illusionary Image V, Invisibility – Mass, Scintillating Pattern, Sunlight II
      -   Metal: Iron Body
      -   Mist/Smoke: Illusionary Image V, Invisibility - Mass
      -   Water: Polar Ray III
      -   Wind: Invisibility – Mass
   o   Level 9: Time Stop
      -   Crystal: Conjure Elemental V (Earth), Scrye V
      -   Darkness: Conjure Elemental V (Air)
      -   Dust/Sand: Control Weather V, Conjure Elemental V (Air, Earth)
      -   Earth: Conjure Elemental V (Earth)
      -   Fire: Conjure Elemental V (Fire)
      -   Ice: Control Weather V, Conjure Elemental V (Air, Water)
      -   Lava: Conjure Elemental V (Earth, Fire)
      -   Light: Conjure Elemental V (Air)
      -   Lightning: Control Weather V, Conjure Elemental V (Air)
      -   Metal: Conjure Elemental V (Earth)
      -   Mist/Smoke: Conjure Elemental V (Air)
      -   Water: Control Weather V, Conjure Elemental V (Water), Scrye V
      -   Wind: Control Weather V, Conjure Elemental V (Air)
      -   Wood: Conjure Elemental V (Earth)

FAERIE PACT
•   Pact Skill: Blend
•   Eldritch Blast Damage Type: Sonic damage
•   Pact Revealed II: You gain the Faerie Heritage feat.
•   Pact Revealed II: You gain the Faerie Legacy feat.
•   Pact Revealed III: The higher of your Dexterity or Charisma scores rises by 1, and you bonus with opposed Bluff checks increases by an additional 6 (for a total of +16). If you previously chose, or choose to grow insect-like wings, you no longer suffer any associated penalties to action dice for doing so.
•   Pact Boon Choices:
   o   Always Ready: You may always act during surprise rounds.
   o   Channeling the Pact: Once per session as a 1-minute action, you may choose 1 NPC quality from the following choices that lasts until the end-of the scene: Aquatic II; Attractive II; Beguiling; Cagey I; Chameleon (1 terrain) I; Damage Reduction 1; Darkvision I; Favored Foes (up to 3 types); Fearless I; Honorable; Improved Senses (Hearing); Improved Stability; Menacing Threat; Natural Spell (Cure Wounds III, Nature’s Ally III, Neutralize Poison or Pass without Trace); Superior Runner I, Tricky (Venom Master)
   o   Charming: When you successfully Taunt a character, you may decline the standard result to have your target become fixated on you for 1d6 rounds. Special characters and villains may spend 1 action die to cancel this effect and become immune to this ability for the rest of the scene. If you gain this benefit from multiple sources, you may also damage the target once without interrupting his fixation (you may do this only once, no matter how many times you gain the benefit).
   o   Court Connected: Once per adventure as a free action, you may gain a free Reconnaissance favor with a cost equal to your Class Level + 5. Unless used, this Favor is lost at the end of the scene.
   o   Empowered Blast: You’re a conduit of eldritch energy. When attacking with your Eldritch Blast, you benefit from the Angry Hornet and Bullseye feats.
   o   Expertise: Taking 10 with your Pact Skill doesn’t take twice as long and taking 20 takes only 10 times as long.
   o   Forceful Blast:  It costs you 1 fewer action dice to activate a critical hit against with your Eldritch Blast (minimum 0).
   o   Gifted with Animals: You’re considered to have 5 additional ranks in Survival when training animals. This may cause you to exceed your maximum skill rank for these activities.
   o   Rebuke: You’re an instrument of eldritch devotion. Characters you successfully Turn also suffer an amount of damage equal to your Resolve bonus. This extra damage is of the same damage type as your Eldritch Blast.  Those targeted who make their Will saves suffer half this damage (rounded down). You may only choose this ability if you may Turn.
   o   Stick Close and Follow Me:  When you make a Blend check, a single adjacent ally or teammate may share your result. The character must remain within 10 ft. of you to retain this benefit.
   o   Turning: Once per combat you may Turn (see FC p223) characters of 1 Type from the following list (chosen at the time you gain this ability): animal, beast, elemental, fey, plant, spirit, or undead.
•   Pact Invocations:
   o   Level 0: Dancing Lights, Expeditious Retreat, Glow I, Orient Self, Whispers
   o   Level 1: Charm Person I, Color Spray, Concealing Countryside I, Control Weather I, Disguise Self, Entangle, Illusionary Image I, Nature’s Ally I, Pass without Trace, Scrye I, Sleep I
   o   Level 2: Blur,  Calm Emotions, Detect Emotion, Goodberry, Hold Animal, Hold Person, Illusionary Image II, Insanity I, Mirror Images, Silence, Wild Side I
   o   Level 3: Bestow Curse, Charm Person II, Confounding Images, Control Weather II, Counter Magic I, Fly I, Glow II, Illusionary Image III, Invisibility, Nature’s Ally II, Scry II, Sleep II, Tongues I, Verdure
   o   Level 4: Concealing Countryside II, Dimension Door, Flawless Fib, Freedom of Movement, Geas, Illusionary Image IV, Mantle of the Mundane
   o   Level 5: Charm Person III, Control Weather III, Fly II, Illusionary Image V, Insanity II, Natural Attunement, Nature’s Ally III, Scrye III, Teleport I, True Seeing, Wild Side II
   o   Level 6: Blindness/Deafness – Mass, Find the Path, Heroes’ Feast, Illusionary Image IV, Power Word: Recall, Tongues II, Tree Walk
   o   Level 7: Charm Person IV, Control Weather IV, Counter Magic II, Hindsight, Nature’s Ally IV, Phase Door, Scrye IV, Teleport II
   o   Level 8: Insanity III, Invisibility – Mass, Maze, Mind Blank, Pinpoint, Protection from Spells, Scintillating Pattern, Wild Side III
   o   Level 9: Charm Person V, Control Weather V, Counter Magic III, Nature’s Ally V, Scrye V, Time Stop



SIDEBAR

INVOKING (WIS)
Warlocks can spend skill points to purchase ranks in the Invoking skill, which is only available to characters with a Casting Level of 1 or higher. Invoking operates like any other skill.
   Knowledge:  Warlock Pacts; casting techniques; magical nature of pact entities; species knowledge of your pact's species
   Special: Invoking is interchangeable with the Spellcasting skill in regards to feat prerequisites, and acts exactly as the Spellcasting skill in regards to “Attack Spells” and “Spell Defense”.

INVOKING (Varies)
A warlock makes this check to cast invocations he knows. Each warlock may make only 1 Invoking check per round and he must be able to speak aloud to do so.  Invoking is an obvious action and clearly visible to anyone with line of sight to the warlock; to conceal an attempt, the warlock must also make a Prestidigitation check opposed by Notice.
      To make an Invoking check, the warlock spends the allotted casting time + any additional casting time required for tricks and other effects and compares his result to the DC listed on 'Table: Invoking Checks' (see below). With success, the invocation is cast and its effect occurs. With failure, the invocation is not cast and has no effect (a sentient target feels a hostile force or tingle but cannot deduce the nature or origin of the sensation). A failed check does not count as a use of the invocation for that scene.
      With a critical success, the warlock does not expend the use of the cast invocation for that scene if it is a limited use per scene invocation. If it is an at-will use invocation (and not an Attack Spell [FC p112]), the warlock may choose one of the following effects:
•   Reduce casting time to 1 Free Action.
•   Double the spell’s Area if not Personal or Touch.
•   Double 1 numeric benefit from the spell’s effect.
(e.g. A critical success when casting Expeditious Retreat would allow the warlock to cast it as a Free Action, increase the Duration to 2 minutes or increase the speed boost to +40ft.)
      With a critical failure, his confidence is shaken and he suffers a –5 penalty with Invoking checks until he succeeds with an Invoking check or until the end of the current scene, whichever comes first.

Table: Invoking Checks
Spell
Level   DC

0      14
1      17
2      20
3      23
4      26
5      29
6      32
7      35
8      38
9      41


WARLOCK ALIGNED SPELLS
When a warlock gains a spell that is Aligned, this spell is based off their warlock pact, not their alignment. The warlock may cast aligned spells on any character that is not of the same Warlock Pact or a creature of the type associated with their pact. When a spell states that it works for an opposed alignment, the warlock chooses the target character Type at the time they cast the spell.
   Example: An angelic warlock casts Sacred Aura.  They may target any non-Angelic warlock or any non-angel character type (such as Demon, Fey, etc.).

« Last Edit: March 21, 2011, 07:52:46 AM by Khaalis » Logged
Agent 333
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« Reply #22 on: March 18, 2011, 05:21:22 AM »

I like it, though I must say I'm not a fan of "Bargaining" as the skill name. It's like Haggle, only magic! Uh... yeah. I know that Warlocks get their powers from eldritch bargains, but I always figured the "Bargaining" was all over and done with by the time the spells start flying.
Some suggestions:
Thaumaturgy, Witchcraft, Incantation, Spellbinding, Invocation
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« Reply #23 on: March 18, 2011, 07:08:23 AM »

Yeah, I have to say Bargaining wasn't rolling off my tongue either, but it WAS Morgenstern's suggestion so I went with it. However, I do like Invoking and think I'll change it to that for the time being.
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SilvercatMoonpaw
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« Reply #24 on: March 18, 2011, 07:22:47 AM »

It's like Haggle, only magic!
Now we need someone to design a magic class around the Haggle skill. Grin
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« Reply #25 on: March 18, 2011, 07:30:00 AM »

Quote from: SilvercatMoonpaw
Now we need someone to design a magic class around the Haggle skill. Grin

Wasn't that to be the Sha'ir?
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« Reply #26 on: March 18, 2011, 05:39:29 PM »

The one critique I have now is that this class has become a tad SAD compared to other FC base classes.  The casting mechanic is a major part of the class's abilities, and is dependent entirely on Cha for reliability of casting, and save DCs, whereas that of the Mage, by contrast, is based on Int (for reliability), Wis (for spells known) and Cha (for save DCs).  The casting of the Priest, by contrast, is largely independent of attributes beyond a smaller dependence on Cha (for save DCs), but it's a smaller part of the class (being only part of what it gets from paths), and the Priest has no other ability that specifically benefits from Cha.

I'd therefore like to suggest that the casting skill should use some other attribute than Cha (Int, Wis or Con might be appropriate).
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« Reply #27 on: March 18, 2011, 07:11:15 PM »

Just a quick thought. If you get a chance look at the Witch kit in the AD&D 2e Wizard's Handbook. This is a similar idea and while a clunky tack-on to a class in a very different mechanic it might provide some inspiration esp. in the fluff department.
Will this go to the database when ready? Just that it will save me from having to paste it into a player's handout to have it at my fingertips
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« Reply #28 on: March 18, 2011, 10:44:12 PM »

The one critique I have now is that this class has become a tad SAD compared to other FC base classes.  The casting mechanic is a major part of the class's abilities, and is dependent entirely on Cha for reliability of casting, and save DCs, whereas that of the Mage, by contrast, is based on Int (for reliability), Wis (for spells known) and Cha (for save DCs).  The casting of the Priest, by contrast, is largely independent of attributes beyond a smaller dependence on Cha (for save DCs), but it's a smaller part of the class (being only part of what it gets from paths), and the Priest has no other ability that specifically benefits from Cha.

I'd therefore like to suggest that the casting skill should use some other attribute than Cha (Int, Wis or Con might be appropriate).

I'm not really sure I agree. Fluff wise, CHA makes the most sense. Invoking is about activating/triggering/forcing forth 'natural spells' and CHA is the summation of personal presence, and the "mental force" behind a spell. Should we change the Invoking skill just for the sake of making the class more MAD?

As you stated, divine casting requires no real attribute dependency but on the flip side, mages need 3 attributes. The warlock on the other hand, sits in the middle. By a purely mechanical standpoint, that would put the class at a 1.5 attribute dependency. The question is - round up or down? When compared to the mage, the warlock still requires a skill to cast spells but has a 5-10% less chance of success, gets less spells and less choice of spells, can basically only cast each spell once per scene, and only has 1 way  to increase their known spells beyond a specific base (1 feat) unlike a mage who has a multitude of ways to increase their spells known and is a much more flexible caster. From the mage mechanics, that basically means WIS is unnecessary since it is the 'spells known' stat.  Like a priest, spell-casting isn't the core of the class. Its important, but it is not the sole defining characteristic of the class like a mage. All in all, I think putting the class at a single attribute dependency for spellcasting really isn't a gamebreaker here, especially when the alternative was to simply make their spells act like divine spells and thus have no dependency other than a minor reliance on CHA for those few save spells they may get.

If not CHA for Invoking... 
INT is about knowledge and a warlock's spells aren't based on knowledge but are granted innate powers, not to mention if you go INT, from a mechanical standpoint, you may just as well have given the class Spellcasting from the get-go rather than a new variant on the skill. WIS is the 'spells known' stat and doesn't really apply in that respect, however it could be stretched to represent a form of "willpower" to cast invocations even though by core FC that is already defined as CHA. That leaves CON as a choice, but CON is about physical wellness and not anything mental, and the class really doesn't reflect a style of magic that feeds on physical health so CON doesn't make a lot of sense.

So that basically brings me back to... Is it really so bad that they have only 1 "primary caster" attribute for a hybrid caster, especially when doing so puts them a slight disadvantage over divine casting methods? Personally, I think it is a pretty fair trade-off when the class still benefits pretty strongly from other stats like DEX, CON, and INT. The only real "dump stat" for the class (as much as there is such a thing in FC) is STR.
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« Reply #29 on: March 20, 2011, 05:17:28 AM »

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So that basically brings me back to... Is it really so bad that they have only 1 "primary caster" attribute for a hybrid caster, especially when doing so puts them a slight disadvantage over divine casting methods? Personally, I think it is a pretty fair trade-off when the class still benefits pretty strongly from other stats like DEX, CON, and INT.

Don't get me wrong - overall, I like the class, and I see where you're coming from on this topic.  However, this part of the design does seem contrary to the design philosophy of other FC classes, which generally spread the attribute dependency from class abilities (so that the Priest has a slight Cha-dependent ability in path casting, and a Wis dependent 10/20, for instance).  This is the only attribute-dependent class ability the Warlock has (the benefits from other stats being only of the generic variety) and it's dependent on only one attribute; hence the minor issue.
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