Building a effective fencer in Fantasy Craft

[ArawnNox]

Is there anything that lets you substitute your Dex Modifier for attack rolls? The finesse quality substitutes it for damage but I think I missed one that lets you use dex instead of str.

The "Deft X" line of tricks in the Adventure Companion. You still need a strength score of 13 or better.

[Krensky]

They're tricks, so you can't use them with another attack trick.

[ArawnNox]

They're tricks, so you can't use them with another attack trick.

Unless, of course, you build your fencer as a Martial Artist, but even then, Masters Touch comes at levels 10 and 20.

[pawsplay]

Even then, it's probably more efficient to snag increases to Dex and/or Str via Talent, Species, and Species feats, leaving you free to use other tricks. I think of a trick that allows Dex to-hit is more like a situational for a high-Dex character, rather than a good way to build a character's central attack capability.

[ArawnNox]

Yeah, it might be something for someone based around using a bow, where their strength score isn't that big of a factor.

[Krensky]

The attack base shifting tricks are for providing combat competence to non-combat characters. Like a Courtier with no combat tricks taking Deceptive X. The courtier my Runelords game would benefit from it after their first attribute boost.

They're also good for those characters who can apply more then one trick.

Lastly they make a good choice for combat characters focused on an ability other then the norm when they want a boost to hit and don't mind or have no choice to forgo other tricks.

[Morgenstern]

The fencer archtype to me doesn't say "low strength". They do all kinds of impressive physical activities that demand excellent strength-to-bodymass ratios. What the archtype really says to me is "not bulky". Any Talent that boosts Strength or Dex and deducts Constitution should play pretty well as the starting point for such a character.

But really, the attribute mods on talents just support themes - the ability to spend character points to pump up whaever stats you like can over turn those modifiers pretty easily if you see a bundle of other Talent benefits that hits the highlights of what you're after.

As mentioned elsewhere, full attack bonus outstrips defense bonuses as level goes up. What I'd be more concerned with is figuring out how ot get the best Defense bonus I can. High dex is a start, but the right class mix and some very selective feat choices will be crucial.

The other thing to consider is your tricks. There are quite a few that are bought seperately rather than as part of a feat that can do wonders for a swashbuckling build. Covering your swordplay through those frees up feats for style and mobility.

[Nova]

As I recently got Fantasy Craft and started skimming through it and making character ideas I came across the fencing feats. Then I decided it would be cool to step out of my element and make a nimble, fencing type of character - full of panache, style but still deadly in combat.

The question is - how to do it? I have seen any feat that would allow to substitute my Str bonus to attack rolls for a Dex one. This is totally crucial in this case - if not one would have to go for a Str based character to actually hit stuff. Other than that I need advice on how to make this type of char a effective combatant. Any suggestions?

Go martial Artist, instead of soldier. The level 10 ability will let you apply two tricks at a time. Coincidentally it also lets you take the qi feats and use'em, once you get it, with your fencing weapons, if you so choose. Perhaps you could take a specialty that includes 'menacing threat'.

The fencing feats are nice, but a lot of it is going to be tricks. The adventuring companion book has lots of tricks letting you substitute any of the stats for STR or DEX when making attacks, and you can use dex instead of str when using a finesse weapon for damage. If the target's proving easy enough to hit, forego applying one of your two-tricks-per-attack to "use dex for attack roll" for something else, something nastier.

Now throw in some levels of Gallant, some style feats... like glint of madness if you got menacing threat. whatever you can fit that remains should probably go into mobility, legend, renown and the like.

You'll have a mobile, agile fighter with the weapon of your choice capable of applying melee and unarmed combat tricks to it, benefiting perhaps from edge or lots of action dice, loaded with tricks and immune to them, and just as damaging with words as with his blade.

[Desertpuma]

Plus if you want to be annoying pick up the feat Mage Hunter from the Adventure Companion. Sure you'll never be able to cast spells once you take it but the innate Spell Defense, which keys off your Charisma stat, is awesome.

[Typhon]

For feats, my fencer burglar went Fencing Supremacy then going Knife Basics (stance can be sweet-remember, your sword is a 1-handed melee attack as well! additionally, now the Main Gauche you use for your offhand is considered armed at all times, so +1 to your Defense as long as you have it on you), Mastery (The Blade Flurry added with the stance damage is pretty nasty), Supremacy (an extra die of sneak along with an insta-kill [don't try it on a caster, though], and with the Fencing Supremacy, it's pretty much 2 dead mooks a round).

Also, don't forget when you get into a situation where you don't wanna kill anyone (just showing off at a party "duel" or if you find yourself in a bar brawl) you can choose to inflict stress damage with your fencing blade instead.

[Dace]

Awww I was hoping there was a feat somewhere that just did it.

[Zdan]

Thanks for the feedback everyone. Looks like I have A TON of options. Cool - I love options in my games.

A question about the Martial Artist class - is this unarmed-based or weapon-based class?

[Krensky]

Thanks for the feedback everyone. Looks like I have A TON of options. Cool - I love options in my games.

A question about the Martial Artist class - is this unarmed-based or weapon-based class?

I would say it is primarily an unarmed class but only by a little.

It's first level ability grants Martial Arts (and the class is a good way to pick that feat up without meeting it's attribute requirements) which primarily boosts your unarmed attacks. Most of the abilities under Ploy are unarmed tricks. That said, most of it's abilities are good for melee or unarmed fighting, and after level 10 melee  and unarmed are essentially the same thing.

[Golden Dragon]

A question about the Martial Artist class - is this unarmed-based or weapon-based class?

It does both, although it favors unarmed combat. It's 6,9,12,15,18 progression is for tricks for unarmed attacks. It does provide bonus feats for unarmed or melee combat, and eventually allows the use of unarmed tricks with melee weapons, and melee tricks with unarmed attacks.

It's main advantage is that at level 10, it allows the use of two tricks on each attack. With two feat chains that apply to fencing, being able to double up on tricks on one attack could be useful. It's something to try.

[Zdan]

I see. It might be fun to try something like that. Shame it's a little skimpy on the bonus feats but it is to be expected. As you present it seems loaded with cool abilities.

Edit: It also gave me an idea for a character - a ogre martial artist - basicly a sohei type char being a resilient focused person overcoming his savage nature through martial arts training. Awesomesauce.