Computers Skill in SC3

[Crafty_Pat]

The only thing I'm currently a little pensive about is one of Pat's throwaway statements in another thread that SpyCraft 3 [and likely 10k Bullets] will have more skills then FantasyCraft - which is something I really don't want to happen.  But I figure, if 2 or 3 extra skills is my biggest worry for the future of my favourite system, then my gaming life is pretty damn sweet right now, isn't it?

Indeed. Don't worry about skill proliferation. Alex and I are quite happy with the current skill set and only interested in adding skills with no fantasy parallel (like, say, Computers).

I've never considered basic math much of number crunching.

The only downside to RM was how long it took to do the combat

There's a correlation there most folks overlook. It's not that the math is basic - it's the number of calculations. Pile on one too many and even the most mathematically inclined are overwhelmed. As with all things it's best for the designer to shoot a bit off from "average" (in this case, erring on the side of simplicity).

[Sletchman]

The only thing I'm currently a little pensive about is one of Pat's throwaway statements in another thread that SpyCraft 3 [and likely 10k Bullets] will have more skills then FantasyCraft - which is something I really don't want to happen.  But I figure, if 2 or 3 extra skills is my biggest worry for the future of my favourite system, then my gaming life is pretty damn sweet right now, isn't it?

Indeed. Don't worry about skill proliferation. Alex and I are quite happy with the current skill set and only interested in adding skills with no fantasy parallel (like, say, Computers).

That's what I figured.  I know it's too early to say with any certainty, but what are the odds you could give a tiny bit of insight into your current thought for the extra skills?

I ask because I'm currently running a Warhammer 40k game using FantasyCraft, and I've just added Programming, Electronics and Mechanics as Craft focuses, and I use Investigate for actual hacking.  I'm a little concerned about Craft becoming a bit too "must have" with this sort of setup or investigate being more useful then it should be, but it seems to be working pretty well so far.  Just curious is all.

[Catodon]

When you do get to it don't forget:
Crafting (tissue engineering)
Crafting (bioreactors)
Crafting (genetic design)
etc.

[Gentry]

I'm rather a fan of adding foci rather than skills. Good thought.

[Crafty_Pat]

That's what I figured.  I know it's too early to say with any certainty, but what are the odds you could give a tiny bit of insight into your current thought for the extra skills?

I ask because I'm currently running a Warhammer 40k game using FantasyCraft, and I've just added Programming, Electronics and Mechanics as Craft focuses, and I use Investigate for actual hacking.  I'm a little concerned about Craft becoming a bit too "must have" with this sort of setup or investigate being more useful then it should be, but it seems to be working pretty well so far.  Just curious is all.

We're a bit too far out to be talking publicly about the modern skill list. I can say that I, personally - not speaking for Alex here, but I'm pretty sure he agrees - believe that general computer use should not be covered by Crafting, which is all about building things. Now, building computers is a different story, and almost certainly a focus. So you're at least partially in the same general mindspace as those at the home office.

Hope you have fun with your game!

[pawsplay]

Using a computer seems a lot like Investigate to me. Then you have computers that give a bonus, and a Hacker Expert that gains a bonus to Investigate if he can use a computer, etc. See?

[Catodon]

The old traveller split of computer use vs programming.
the first is perhaps a bonus to other skills. THe second could be a crafting focus I suppose...

[Sletchman]

The old traveller split of computer use vs programming.

That's what I was thinking of when I split it between Craft (Programming) and Investigate [usually with a bonus based on relative power of the computer].

I can certainly see the simplicity of having it all be governed by a single skill.

[Typhon]

Ahhh good ole traveler! Had one game where we ran into Space Smurfs.

A lot of systems divide the two. It's a pretty good idea. Use is more for speed work (programming added a bonus) like hacking on the fly and the programming was more for slow coding/decoding stuff like cooking up a trojan for a specific target.

[Crafty_Alex]

Using a computer seems a lot like Investigate to me. Then you have computers that give a bonus, and a Hacker Expert that gains a bonus to Investigate if he can use a computer, etc. See?

That's what we did in 2.0. A lot of people didn't get it without explanation; in my experience - nearly everyone.

[Catodon]

Wierd
Then again my real world work would be actually impossible without computers (provides a bonus) but I know zero programming (separate skill) so maybe that's why it seems bleeding obvious to me.

[Crafty_Alex]

That's why this isn't fully sorted. Technology has a very different role in modern day than it does in Fantasy - this is the place I anticipate most changes in skills will happen (nothing solid yet).

[pawsplay]

Using a computer seems a lot like Investigate to me. Then you have computers that give a bonus, and a Hacker Expert that gains a bonus to Investigate if he can use a computer, etc. See?

That's what we did in 2.0. A lot of people didn't get it without explanation; in my experience - nearly everyone.

Seriously? you could just mention "someone else's data" under things you can research as an example, a cypher as a puzzle or riddle, and a computer search as a way of gathering information and it would be, I think, really obvious. You could write "or computer database" next to every place "library" appears under the skill.

Seriously, it is the correct approach. all you need is the right explanation. That is far better than putting those applications under the skill, then trying to explain why some things should be Technology/computer as opposed to Investigate. As it is written now, Investigate allows you to do everything a hacker does, though you may not necessarily do it with a computer.

[Mister Andersen]

Computer coding? Make it a Language interest.
Utilising computer hardware? Study interest.
Creating computer/electronic hardware? Crafting focus.

[Catodon]

Not just investigate.
Computers are absolutely essential for high level uses of many 'crafting' focuses. In the future this will be more and more the case. In my experience any kind of high end engineering or genetic manipulation have to use computers you simply can't do current work in these areas without a computer pen and paper cannot do it.