Any update to Martial Artist due to FC 2nd printing?

[Gilbetron]

Given the change to the Martial Arts feat, is there any chance to the Martial Artist class?  The 1st printing version of Martial Artist was quite a bit more powerful, and it seems that the Martial Artist class was built around it.  It made me wonder if anyone has modified the class at all...

[EloiseCartwright]

I can't see it changing personally, it still seems to hold it's own to me.

[Gentry]

I agree. I'm putting finishing touches on Wyrmstone's iconic Martial Artist character, and she's a beast and a half, even with the change to Martial Arts. The class still works great.

[Crafty_Alex]

Given the change to the Martial Arts feat, is there any chance to the Martial Artist class?  The 1st printing version of Martial Artist was quite a bit more powerful, and it seems that the Martial Artist class was built around it.  It made me wonder if anyone has modified the class at all...

No. The class remains just as butch, plus the feat is no longer broken. Playing a Martial Artist will still allow you to have Master's Art at first level and just as much power...and then some.

[ArawnNox]

I'm running one in a PbP game and it seems pretty solid to me. I'm excited to see how the class develops over the course of the game and how well it meshes with my plans to pick up the Swashbuckler Expert Class.

[Dawnblade]

Given the change to the Martial Arts feat, is there any chance to the Martial Artist class?  The 1st printing version of Martial Artist was quite a bit more powerful, and it seems that the Martial Artist class was built around it.  It made me wonder if anyone has modified the class at all...

No. The class remains just as butch, plus the feat is no longer broken. Playing a Martial Artist will still allow you to have Master's Art at first level and just as much power...and then some.

Seems to me because the class just gives you the Martial Arts feat and since its a base class it dosent have the prerequisite of 13 str and dex and unarmed forte making it just as broken as before seeing as masters art only requires you to have the previous feat.  Almost all the martial artist builds I made included fisrt level martial artist for the feat and awesome core ability anyways.

[aegis]

Huhu, you don't want to make a martial artist with low Dex and/or Str. You just don't. The prereqs are meant for non-combatants who would want to pick up a single feat to dramatically enhance their Defense, Initiative, and unarmed fighting skill. This was arguably broken. But a melee fighter who ignores Dex and/or Str because he can take Martial Arts without the prereqs, that's just plain ... foolish, to say the least.

[Grimace]

I was very tempted to play a Martial Artist, Heck I'm still tempted.  They are a very nice class.

[Crafty_Alex]

Seems to me because the class just gives you the Martial Arts feat and since its a base class it dosent have the prerequisite of 13 str and dex and unarmed forte making it just as broken as before seeing as masters art only requires you to have the previous feat.

That is indeed true. For the minmaxers who want to use Martial Arts in the same way you could pre-errata, 1 level in Martial Artist is the key (since it is granted by the class automatically, you don't have to meet the Str/Dex/forte prereqs).

[Gilbetron]

Huhu, you don't want to make a martial artist with low Dex and/or Str. You just don't. The prereqs are meant for non-combatants who would want to pick up a single feat to dramatically enhance their Defense, Initiative, and unarmed fighting skill. This was arguably broken. But a melee fighter who ignores Dex and/or Str because he can take Martial Arts without the prereqs, that's just plain ... foolish, to say the least.

It's not for all builds, I agree, but it gives you the option for cool fighters based on other stats besides Str & Dex.  Or even ones that focus on just Str or just Dex. 

[Grimace]

Seems to me because the class just gives you the Martial Arts feat and since its a base class it dosent have the prerequisite of 13 str and dex and unarmed forte making it just as broken as before seeing as masters art only requires you to have the previous feat.

That is indeed true. For the minmaxers who want to use Martial Arts in the same way you could pre-errata, 1 level in Martial Artist is the key (since it is granted by the class automatically, you don't have to meet the Str/Dex/forte prereqs).

If you multiclass into MA and already have the Martial Arts feat, does it allow you to pick another unarmed feat?

[Crafty_Alex]

If you multiclass into MA and already have the Martial Arts feat, does it allow you to pick another unarmed feat?

Yes, per the standard rules. The logical path is Master's Art...

[ArawnNox]

Huhu, you don't want to make a martial artist with low Dex and/or Str. You just don't. The prereqs are meant for non-combatants who would want to pick up a single feat to dramatically enhance their Defense, Initiative, and unarmed fighting skill. This was arguably broken. But a melee fighter who ignores Dex and/or Str because he can take Martial Arts without the prereqs, that's just plain ... foolish, to say the least.

Orly? My current MA has a Dex of 10. I made up for it with origin choices that gave me two instances of Agile Defense, and carry a main gauche with a fencer themed fighting style (Planning on blending Sword Circle and Fencing trees). It hasn't hurt me hardly at all.

[aegis]

10 sure isn't high, but it isn't incredibly low either. Several reasons why you should not forget about Dex:
- Reflex saves, of course;
- ranged attacks, when you can't go to contact, even if melee is your specialty;
- Acrobatics, if you want to move freely and avoid being tripped from your stances;
- and several other skills for which Dex is key, including skills useful in combat like Bluff or Prestidigitation, and the always useful Sneak.

It doesn't mean you can't play a low Dex character. FC makes it quite playable thanks to many options. But even with Martial/Master's Arts, Dex remains a very very useful attribute.

[Psion]

10 sure isn't high, but it isn't incredibly low either. Several reasons why you should not forget about Dex:
- Reflex saves, of course;
- ranged attacks, when you can't go to contact, even if melee is your specialty;
- Acrobatics, if you want to move freely and avoid being tripped from your stances;
- and several other skills for which Dex is key, including skills useful in combat like Bluff or Prestidigitation, and the always useful Sneak.

It doesn't mean you can't play a low Dex character. FC makes it quite playable thanks to many options. But even with Martial/Master's Arts, Dex remains a very very useful attribute.

So like all other builds, it has tradeoffs.

Nonetheless:
1) It makes for a nice bump for a less than combat optimized character in a combat heavy game. Frex, your courtier might not have 13 strength, but it's nice to redeploy some of that charisma towards an ability that will get you out of a scrape. Also very nice to model concepts like a wispy little pech who manages to hold his own by sheer talent.
2) A character with a 12 dex isn't substantially worse off in the dex department than one with 13. But those are two points that are well spent elsewhere.

I might take exception (and go out of my way to make regret) a player who takes scores down to 8 in order to buy up one stat. But I hated that sort of play WITHOUT martial arts, so already take measures against that.