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Sletchman
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« Reply #15 on: August 30, 2010, 12:22:09 AM »

Why do you want to spend prep time making up firearms and gear rather then prepping missions? A detailed gear list is far more useful then a generic list. Writing up weapons is far harder then you seem to think (go look in the New Guns thread). Especially since Crafty isn't telling us the formula for converting ballistics to game stats. It doesn't need to be as long as the one in SC2.0, but it needs to be far more then just generic guns.

Agreed - that was actually the thing that initially turned me off Spycraft - the generic weapon list in the book.  As luck would have it, the Modern Arms Guide was released about a week later [after I started playing], which was great.  I wouldn't be opposed to a similiar system for Spycraft 3 to be honest - a smaller list in the core book, and a big book of ways to kill your enemies soon after [as long as it was soon of course - I don't want to use a "Light Pistol" for long...].
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mathey
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« Reply #16 on: August 30, 2010, 01:06:53 PM »

Making up weapons is easy as pie. "Its a gun. It shoots people. It does 1dx damage. It has x bullets. Go."

Consulting a massive, detailed list of highly specific weapons stats and possible modifications based on carefully researched testing data and informed by the field experience of gun nuts? Kinda hard, especially if you yourself are not a gun nut.

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ArawnNox
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« Reply #17 on: August 30, 2010, 01:23:49 PM »

Making up weapons is easy as pie. "Its a gun. It shoots people. It does 1dx damage. It has x bullets. Go."

Consulting a massive, detailed list of highly specific weapons stats and possible modifications based on carefully researched testing data and informed by the field experience of gun nuts? Kinda hard, especially if you yourself are not a gun nut.


Unless you have a player like I do, who, while not a gun-nut, is a highly technical person who is very detail oriented. I once watched him, in a GURPS game, craft the equivalent of a sniper rifle in a setting where the highest tech gunpowder would be an iron cannon, all the while using real-world knowledge to justify it. *mind boggles*

I'm not familiar with SC 2's layout or anything, but I don't know why you couldn't split the difference and have a small selection of common/iconic guns in each classification.
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Krensky
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« Reply #18 on: August 30, 2010, 01:58:38 PM »

Making up weapons is easy as pie. "Its a gun. It shoots people. It does 1dx damage. It has x bullets. Go."

Consulting a massive, detailed list of highly specific weapons stats and possible modifications based on carefully researched testing data and informed by the field experience of gun nuts? Kinda hard, especially if you yourself are not a gun nut.



It's not that easy. If you did it on a regular basis you'd know that. It's far harder to do then to go look up the gun in the gear charts or to ask someone on the boards to do it for you.
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rgpandrade
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« Reply #19 on: August 30, 2010, 06:39:42 PM »

Martial arts as presented in the 2.0 or FC book works just fine for a game.

Similarly, for SC3, reducing the gear section to generic firearms would annoy me to no end.

Your complicated martial arts thing works for your table, great. It would annoy mine to no end. Similarly you may be fine with generic weapons, my table and I are not.

If I want exacting and detailed martial arts, I'll play or make a game dedicated to the martial arts genre and world.

I think that both needs can be accomidated by having a simple template with examples.  In the case of firearms stating that "a 9mm has a particular damage type and weighs from this to this" and then giving a specific example allows for someone to come to you as the GM with an idea for a weapon their character would carry and, using the template would make it easier for the details to be worked in as opposed to having to hunt that information down.  For myself I would rather have the template as opposed to the long list Smiley

Why do you want to spend prep time making up firearms and gear rather then prepping missions? A detailed gear list is far more useful then a generic list. Writing up weapons is far harder then you seem to think (go look in the New Guns thread). Especially since Crafty isn't telling us the formula for converting ballistics to game stats. It doesn't need to be as long as the one in SC2.0, but it needs to be far more then just generic guns.

I was not aware that crafty was not giving out the formula.  But that is okay since with a little reserach I made my own.  It did not take me much in the way of prep time either; I just came up with the template and made the players do the math.
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Sletchman
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« Reply #20 on: August 30, 2010, 07:12:10 PM »

Making up weapons is easy as pie. "Its a gun. It shoots people. It does 1dx damage. It has x bullets. Go."

Consulting a massive, detailed list of highly specific weapons stats and possible modifications based on carefully researched testing data and informed by the field experience of gun nuts? Kinda hard, especially if you yourself are not a gun nut.

That's why I wouldn't be opposed to a smaller list in the core book [I totally recognise that not all folks are technical people / gun nuts] with a "big book of guns" as an addition.  I wouldn't even be against a listing that is just one weapon for each caliber [weapon caliber, not gear chart caliber] for the core book - so long as there is either list coming, or we can get the damage formula [though part of me suspects it's one part science and one part art - like most things Crafty].
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rgpandrade
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« Reply #21 on: August 30, 2010, 07:28:17 PM »

I just think that the concept of using guns as a crutch in a game like this is very limiting.  I use the template I created for guns and hardly even look at the list. Smiley
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mathey
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« Reply #22 on: September 02, 2010, 12:26:26 AM »

Quote
It's not that easy. If you did it on a regular basis you'd know that. It's far harder to do then to go look up the gun in the gear charts or to ask someone on the boards to do it for you.

No, not really.

.22 LR weapons do 1d4+2.
9mm weapons do 1d10+1.
.45 do 1d12.
5.56 do 4d4.
7.62 do 4d4+2.

Obviously there are more specifics regarding qualities, weight, recoil, error and threat for the guns in the 2.0 rules. In practice, however, I don't find that getting all of those letter perfect in my games is necessary or even desired. Shockingly, most of my players couldn't give a darn about getting all those kind of specifics 100% correct in ANY system.
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Goodlun
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« Reply #23 on: September 03, 2010, 01:07:02 PM »

So I have decided to run a Martial Arts based campaign for my group(just not to sure as to when).  After looking at my old GURPS 4th ed- Martial Arts; Ninjas & Super Spies;D20 Blood & Fists; D20 modern w/ Martial Arts Mayhem books and of course our good friend Spycraft 2.0.  I have to say its a hard call their are things I really like about each system.
GURPs well GURPs is GURPs I love the level of detail the level of options and the ability to make it as cinematographic or realistic as I would want.  But it is still GURPs and I am just not wild about their mechanics at the end of the day.
Ninjas & Super Spies does one thing very well that no other rpg company has yet to do with Martial Arts and that is the Martial Art you choice to practice really defines your character.  The biggest thing they do right is you are a black belt right out the door with either all or the majority of the moves and abilities of the art.
On top of that every martial art feels very different even ones that are similar.  Example in NSS taekwondo & kick boxing feel very different even though both arts are very kick heavy and have similar martial art powers.  but yes there is a but the actual mechanics and numbers are awful not to mention the moves, abilities and descriptions of the Martial Art have a tendency to not line up with reality. 
D20 well we all know about D20   
Spycraft has some of the best combat mechanics out there.  You can model a martial art using feats and skills but it is hard to have a black belt at 1st level in what ever system you want.  Than there is the problem that a Judo guy the bjj guy, a Sambo guy and a Wrestler all still end up feeling pretty much the same in the end. 
Maybe I will  just put it off till 3rd ed and 10k comes out to see what is offered up.
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