Table of Ouch... useless?

[Rossi]

Hi guys, I was trying the system and, during a combat, one of the "test players" activated a threat... a critical hit! We got excited and decided to see what were our options:
1 - Spend one action die to apply the result directly to the opponent's wounds;
2 - Spend TWO action dice and, IF THE DAMAGE IS HIGHER than that opponent's Con, use the Table of Ouch...

Well, unless you're fighting large or larger creatures, applying the damage directly to the opponent wound is always better, as it effectively kills the target. There is something wrong with my thinking? Is wounds really that low? They don't ever escalate?

Thanks!

[mind flayer]

What you are missing is that the GM can throw Action Dice to confirm a critical attack, and rolling on the table of ouch is typically a better choice when the PC is the one getting beat down.  Critical injuries last longer, lead to more interesting role playing opportunities, and, most importantly, will rarely outright kill a PC.  No one wants their character to buy it because a minion rolled a natural 20 three rooms into a dungeon.

[Krensky]

Also, remember the other way you get to that table, massive damage. If you take more then 25 points of damage (including keen) and fail the save, you're rolling on the table too.

[Sletchman]

If you know the villian is too important to kill, cripple him instead.  [I don't mean metagame wise, I mean like you are told "hey don't kill him"].  Broken limbs is very definately not dead.

EDIT: Also some enemies are immune to critical hits, but not critical injuries - Undead for example.  So being able to batter or break an undead enemies [especially a powerful special NPCs] limbs is extremely useful in limiting their ability to fight.

[aegis]

As Krensky said, I've rarely used the Table of Ouch because of critical hits, but rather because of massive damage. As a GM, I also prefer to spend two action dice and cripple a PC rather than effectively try to kill him (unless I have an excellent reason to do so). Role-playing wounded characters can be quite an interesting experience, if your players are open minded.

[Mister Andersen]

Also, your GC can house rule that critical injuries cost 1 ad less to activate (something there doesn;t seem to be a campaign quality for)

[aegis]

No, but there is the Hewn Limbs campaign quality that makes critical injuries more frequent and more deadly. 

[Mister Andersen]

The problem is specifically the cost involved -- it's a disincentive to spend multiple AD on crit injuries as opposed to one for a crit hit

[Rossi]

It is exactly what Mister Andersen said. My players aren't overpower but is a little too much metagame for our tastes "don't kill the villain because if so he will not became a recurring villain" and stuff like that.
I'm thinking about changing costs between damaging wounds directly and using the Table of Ouch.

[Wolverine]

I'm thinking about changing costs between damaging wounds directly and using the Table of Ouch.

Which means the players have to spend more AD to turn their well deserved Crits into straight-to-Wounds goodness. If they're happy with it, that's fine, but I would certainly run it past them first.

[Charlie_X]

Remember Keen as a quality reduces the amount of damage you need to do, and massive amounts of damage can cause the table of ouch to hit automatically.

As my group have been levelling (up to five now, six by the season's end) they're nearing the ouch zone more and more. Give it time, it'll happen.

[TheAuldGrump]

It is exactly what Mister Andersen said. My players aren't overpower but is a little too much metagame for our tastes "don't kill the villain because if so he will not became a recurring villain" and stuff like that.
I'm thinking about changing costs between damaging wounds directly and using the Table of Ouch.

I saw a weird variant of hat in my Fallout game a few weeks ago - the hench-villain getting hit with the Table of Ouch, then another player asking 'if I can get the guy healed, can I take him as a Contact?'.... 

I had no further plans for the guy, so I said yes. It cost him a pile of Action Dice, but they now have a contact inside the Kreigers - a bunch of neo-Nazi bad guys. Then I gave him an Action Die for his cunning plan. The player concerned is fourteen years old. You bet I told him that it was a good idea.

The Auld Grump, that had me about busting at the seams.

[Crafty_Pat]

It is exactly what Mister Andersen said. My players aren't overpower but is a little too much metagame for our tastes "don't kill the villain because if so he will not became a recurring villain" and stuff like that.
I'm thinking about changing costs between damaging wounds directly and using the Table of Ouch.

I saw a weird variant of hat in my Fallout game a few weeks ago - the hench-villain getting hit with the Table of Ouch, then another player asking 'if I can get the guy healed, can I take him as a Contact?'.... 

I had no further plans for the guy, so I said yes. It cost him a pile of Action Dice, but they now have a contact inside the Kreigers - a bunch of neo-Nazi bad guys. Then I gave him an Action Die for his cunning plan. The player concerned is fourteen years old. You bet I told him that it was a good idea.

The Auld Grump, that had me about busting at the seams.

So totally Fallout. Very nice.

[Rossi]

Well, since I'm getting a healthy amount of replies and we're talking about things that strike me as "useless" (ok, not that rough, maybe "less useful" than some other options), let's talk about two weapon fighting and darting weapon.
Both of then let you take an additional attack at -2, right? So what is the point in two weapon fighting? You can use darting weapon with a shield or you MUST be actually with the other hand free? If this last option is the correct then I understand the use of two weapon fighting.

Thanks again!

[mind flayer]

Well, since I'm getting a healthy amount of replies and we're talking about things that strike me as "useless" (ok, not that rough, maybe "less useful" than some other options), let's talk about two weapon fighting and darting weapon.
Both of then let you take an additional attack at -2, right? So what is the point in two weapon fighting? You can use darting weapon with a shield or you MUST be actually with the other hand free? If this last option is the correct then I understand the use of two weapon fighting.

Thanks again!

Actually, you can use the two weapon fighting feats with a shield, as you can bash with your shield for subdual damage.  Aside from fluff reasons, the most likely reason to take TWF over darting weapon would be the ability to access two different weapon feat trees in the same action.  For instance, you could play a sword-and-board fighter with a high-damage weapon in one hand and a shield in the other to benefit from the low-damage stun attacks from Shield Mastery, or you could reel the enemy in with a Whip's Entangle attack trick and knife them to pieces with Shank/Knife Flurry.

Basically, it allows you to benefit from a high-damage weapon and a low damage, utility weapon in one round.