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Author Topic: Newbie GM asks questions  (Read 1475 times)
Vermillion
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« on: February 26, 2010, 03:23:59 AM »

Alright, so as the topic says I'm a newbie GM (to Fantasy Craft) and I'd like to ask questions, and might come back to this topic later to ask more questions.

1.) One of my players has shown a reluctance to take the Bandage feat to qualify for Paladin-hood. Aside from telling him to suck it up and take the Bandage feat, what would an appropriate substitution for Bandage and Lay on Hands be for a Lancer?

2.) Do instances of Adventurer's Luck stack, meaning if two people have Adventurer's Luck, treasure is rolled four times and keeping everything, or is it three times? Or do they not stack at all?

3.) One of my players is concerned that Defense is ridiculously better than DR, and aside from what I've given, (let's assume for this question that I've given nothing, so I can get a full range of answers) what are the advantages of DR over Defense?

Thanks.
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« Reply #1 on: February 26, 2010, 03:37:04 AM »

Bandage is awesome.  So your player should suck it up...
Bandage gives you a free origin skill, the ability to never suffer untrained medicine checks, and the ability to mend someone twice a day when you have your doctors bag.  In short, it makes you the second best non magic combat medic in the game.  The best being a Keeper with bandage.
I can't really think of anything that I would want to replace Lay on Hands(and by extension bandage) in this particular concept of Paladin.

Because of the wording of Adventurers Luck, I would rule they don't stack.  If the monty haul quality was in play, I would let them stack however(Its all about the phat lewts at that point!)

DR is a different than Defense.  Defense scales with level, DR is an investment in your safety.  DR makes it so that when things slip past your defense, you don't suffer the brunt of the blow.  (Its also why Armor reduces the amount of damage you take in 'Craft, rather than making you harder to hit)
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« Reply #2 on: February 26, 2010, 06:13:44 AM »

3.) One of my players is concerned that Defense is ridiculously better than DR, and aside from what I've given, (let's assume for this question that I've given nothing, so I can get a full range of answers) what are the advantages of DR over Defense?

Not sure where this sentiment is coming from.  On the surface, not getting hit may seem better than reducing damage when you get hit, but not taking any damage when you do get hit can be awesome, too.

Someone with Moderate Chainmail w/ Heavy Fittings will get a DR 5, effectively 8 vs edged weapons (Edge Resistance 3).  Even the d12 Long Sword will only break that threshold 1/3 of the time, barring a high strength score, which is not nearly as ubiquitous an occurrence as it is in D&D.

The only resource that this uses up is 325s.  It requires no specific attributes, no feat expenditures nor any specific class to use. Even the Mage could make use of this simple build.  Also, someone who wants to bypass the armor, would have to take a -9 penalty AND have the Called Shot trick.

For this benefit, you are giving up 2 points of defense, 1 point of armor check penalty and move 10ft slower.  If those numbers really bug you, take Armor Basics and drop to light fittings.  The defense penalty, armor check penalty and speed penalty all disappear and you are left with 1 less DR.

Conversely, a high defense build requires a large expenditure of limited resources, specifically, high Dex and levels in small subset of classes that have a good defense bonus.  That isn't to say that defense builds suck vs DR, but I wouldn't say that one is so much better than the other.

The one big flaw with a defense heavy builds that eschews DR that I see comes when your opponent rolls that 20 and activates his critical.  When, not if, that time comes a high defense is going to do you a bit of good.  If you have that high DR, odds are you aren't going to be taking any wounds, and even if you do, they will be slight, but the character who is all defense is going to be hurting bad, if not outright unconscious, and hoping another critical hit doesn't come his way.
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« Reply #3 on: February 26, 2010, 06:43:54 AM »

1.) One of my players has shown a reluctance to take the Bandage feat to qualify for Paladin-hood. Aside from telling him to suck it up and take the Bandage feat, what would an appropriate substitution for Bandage and Lay on Hands be for a Lancer?
Interesting question. I would have first answered "suck it up", but now I think about the more general concept of the paladin. He is, after all, the image of the defender of the faith. But what about an evil - or at least not good-mannered - faith? Maybe then Bandage is not that appropriate (though still very useful). If so, Guts might be a selfish-enough feat (though with similar feel) to be substituted. Also add a restriction to Lay on hands to compensate, like it works only for the character. It's certainly less interesting than the standard paladin package, but that's the cost of not playing by the rules. Tongue
2.) Do instances of Adventurer's Luck stack, meaning if two people have Adventurer's Luck, treasure is rolled four times and keeping everything, or is it three times? Or do they not stack at all?
Considering the phrasing, no.
3.) One of my players is concerned that Defense is ridiculously better than DR, and aside from what I've given, (let's assume for this question that I've given nothing, so I can get a full range of answers) what are the advantages of DR over Defense?
Well, they're two completely different things. Defense is something that allows you to avoid damage. It's all or nothing. If your Defense is higher, you're perfectly safe, if it's lower, you're hit. Damage Reduction, on the other hand, is something that allows you to reduce damage. Contrary to Defense, it doesn't let you ignore it completely (unless the damage is really ridiculous), but on the other hand, it is always effective, including against critical hits.
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« Reply #4 on: February 26, 2010, 06:56:35 AM »

The thing is, while a Paladin can be associated with good, evil, flowers and bunnies, or chains and dripping black oil, they are ALWAYS associated with combat on behalf of their focus/alignment/faith. Where you have combat, you have injured needing to be returned to the fighting, be it with clean bandages and an encourgaging word or a snarl and a boot up their backsides (and with some drill serjeants I've know, the snarl and boot are the tools of the good guys Wink). Healing is not the unique provice of the shiny and bright in Fantasycraft. It a necessary function of any force that can take injuries in the first place.
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« Reply #5 on: February 26, 2010, 08:45:04 AM »

If bandage isn't useful in your game, you need more combats. Wink (Or tougher opponents, or more opponents with treacherous, or more dramatic scenes.)

High defense is useful, to be sure. But if you face off with a horde of small damage creatures, you might be really glad to have that armor. And again, if you find yourself taking lots of wound damage (again, dramatic scenes or treacherous creatures), you'll be happy to have some DR.

Now when you are trading off defense for DR, it's a bit more of a question when to stop. But if you can get DR without a defense penalty (possibly via Armor Basics, Armor Use ability, fitted upgrade) and can afford it, it's a no-brainer.

As for adventurer's luck: it's really up to the GM how much loot they want in their game, but were it me, I wouldn't let them stack. I have one player with the feat, and they are swimming in silver and elixirs.
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« Reply #6 on: February 26, 2010, 09:10:37 AM »

Alright, so as the topic says I'm a newbie GM (to Fantasy Craft) and I'd like to ask questions, and might come back to this topic later to ask more questions.

Welcome. Smiley

1.) One of my players has shown a reluctance to take the Bandage feat to qualify for Paladin-hood. Aside from telling him to suck it up and take the Bandage feat, what would an appropriate substitution for Bandage and Lay on Hands be for a Lancer?

Tell him to suck it up. Or multiclass into Priest. Paladins heal. That's kind of a trope of fantasy rpg and literature for a while. Honestly though, Bandage is a great feat. Does he really want to be a Paladin or does he just want to be a knight who slings the wrath of god?

2.) Do instances of Adventurer's Luck stack, meaning if two people have Adventurer's Luck, treasure is rolled four times and keeping everything, or is it three times? Or do they not stack at all?

It's rolled twice.

3.) One of my players is concerned that Defense is ridiculously better than DR, and aside from what I've given, (let's assume for this question that I've given nothing, so I can get a full range of answers) what are the advantages of DR over Defense?

Well, Defense is potentially slightly better then DR, but not ridiculously. There are a number of spells, effects, and ploys that ignore defense, but DR still applies to. DR's cousin Reduction can be had for mere silver to protect against all those nasty damage types that ignore DR. So the armored knight can glare at the evil wizard and shrug off the worst of his cold and lightning and fire as he stalks him down and cleaves him in two.

Plus, DR (both kinds) work on Crits. Defense doesn't.

Thanks.

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« Reply #7 on: February 26, 2010, 09:48:11 AM »

1.  What is their deity?  If their deity DOES NOT EVER heal (including raise from the dead), then I can see this.  For example, a Storm Deity who granted the ability to do lightning strikes rather than Lay on Hands, or Death's avatars having Lifebane hands.  What to watch for:
A) never substitute just to do it; make sure there is a game-world reason
B) never make the substitution so cool that everyone would rather have it than the original ability.

2.  Adventurer's luck does not 'stack', it just means if one of the two isn't there the benefit still is.  If your players didn't know this, let them decide which of them exchanges it for another feat (if they want to).

3.  Defense is "can't touch me", and DR is "I can take it".  At higher levels, both are common - and so is BAB - and the NPCs/monsters have plenty also.  Why do you want DR?  For one, if the blow cannot be dodged, I'm not totally hosed.  People in heavy armor are often captured instead of killed.  That said, there are also ways past DR (arrows being the most common in my game).  Anyone relying only on one or the other is going to get hosed - hard.
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« Reply #8 on: February 26, 2010, 02:00:17 PM »

As an aside, if your Lancer character just wants to be a battlefield god/knight in shining armor sort of character, staying in Lancer is probably better for him than switching into Paladin. Lancer gets friggin' outrageous at high levels, and essentially becomes its own Expert Class (as do most of the classes in FC, as that goes--the old truism from d20 that the base classes get lame after level 6 is absent from FC).

If he wants to be a "Revered General" type charismatic leader guy, then he's better off multiclassing Lancer with Captain and ignoring Expert Classes (for now).  A Captain with an alignment looks a lot like a non-magical Paladin to me.
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« Reply #9 on: February 26, 2010, 02:11:00 PM »

A paladin without the stuff he wants to avoid looks like a Captain / Priest [with a couple extra bing bangs].  Maybe suggest this combo to him?  In fact I know from experiance that Lancer / Priest combo is rock solid, as is Captain / Priest.
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« Reply #10 on: February 26, 2010, 03:15:40 PM »

For alternate Paladins, I might consider replacing Bandage with "Having taken at least 1 step along one of your Alignment's Paths."

That way, a Paladin of a faith that supports Life (has it as an available Path) could have Bandage, but one who doesn't would have an alternate.

It also preserves the ability of a Paladin not to have been a Priest, but does make it easier for a Priest (not having to take the Blessed feat).
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