Spycraft: Bioshock conversion

[Antilles]

It basically turns your arm into a beehive. Yeah...

[MilitiaJim]

It basically turns your arm into a beehive. Yeah...

It is still early enough in the day for me to bleach that image and sober up for the drive home from the station.     Ugh.  Purge the unclean with FIRE.

[Morgenstern]

While slightly more squishy than the other options, all of them are morphing your arm into something not remotely human, healthy, or appealing.

I spent some time following the video links and think I have a better handle on this. It the order of operations for Spycraft/Mastercraft tonics look like feats - you should be adding them at the rate your class/career level normally allow a feat to be acquired. You could then add a rule that basically lets you get a tonic feat early... but it messes you up pretty darn bad until a selectable feat slot opens up, and then it automatically takes that slot over. Running 2 tonics ahead of the curve being dramically worse, and 3 tonic/feats ahead probably not being something that should be allowed.

[Hida Reju]

One thing to keep in mind is that the more you use ADAM and plasmids the less human you are turning yourself.

You really start to become a monster if your not careful.

[MilitiaJim]

You really start to become a monster if your not careful.

Nietzsche didn't say nuthin' 'bout the abyss bein' full o' bees.

[Morgenstern]

One thing to keep in mind is that the more you use ADAM and plasmids the less human you are turning yourself.

You really start to become a monster if your not careful.

The question is how does something like that play out for players? "Less human" at a glance really isn't much of a deterent to players.

My concern is how much should plasmid-tech put you ahead of the power-curve of regular players. That it makes you superhuman is a given, but the Spycraft/Mastercraft base line is pretty dang far above the norm. For every smidgeon you beat the curve, you need to be looking at tangible, and honestly fairly brutal drawbacks (if this is intended to in any way integrate with the core character options of either game).

That's one reason I suggested the tonics might be treated essentially as feats, but feats you can grab a level or two early. You suffer some setback (driving cravings for ADAM) until your body fully integrates the tonic in the form of burning your next open feat slot as your career level "catches up" with your power level (and the need for a balancing drawback fades).

[Antilles]

Humm... how about treating it like corrupting magic? Every time you take more tonics than your body can safely handle, you gain a level of tainted? Twitchyness, difficulty focusing on anything but getting more ADAM, and eventually you might end up as a splicer (i.e. NPC) sounds fairly appropriate given the fluff.

[MilitiaJim]

Corruption sounds good to me, I'll get some torches and pitchforks for when the bee splicer comes around.  Also, can your body recover as you level up and can better handle the tonics you have taken?

[Hida Reju]

One thing to keep in mind is that the more you use ADAM and plasmids the less human you are turning yourself.

You really start to become a monster if your not careful.

The question is how does something like that play out for players? "Less human" at a glance really isn't much of a deterrent to players.

My concern is how much should plasmid-tech put you ahead of the power-curve of regular players. That it makes you superhuman is a given, but the Spycraft/Mastercraft base line is pretty dang far above the norm. For every smidgeon you beat the curve, you need to be looking at tangible, and honestly fairly brutal drawbacks (if this is intended to in any way integrate with the core character options of either game).

That's one reason I suggested the tonics might be treated essentially as feats, but feats you can grab a level or two early. You suffer some setback (driving cravings for ADAM) until your body fully integrates the tonic in the form of burning your next open feat slot as your career level "catches up" with your power level (and the need for a balancing drawback fades).

You have a valid point that was why I was trying to adapt ideas Fragile Minds to show the stress both physically and mentally on a person using ADAM.

In essence you can trade sanity for power but rapidly without feat investments or some kind of in game cost I wanted it to be a trap that is fairly easy to see. After all quite frankly you have all the evidence in front of you to avoid using it except in limited amounts.