PCs with natural weapons

[dorward]

Some player characters get natural weapons (Saurians for example).

The rules reference the NPC section, which is a little odd, but OK.

I can't find the rules for proficiencies for natural weapons. My instinct is to say they are "Unarmed", but I can make a case for dividing them between "Edged" and "Blunt".

How should they be handled? 

[Crafty_Pat]

Some player characters get natural weapons (Saurians for example).

The rules reference the NPC section, which is a little odd, but OK.

This is to avoid printing the rules in two places (which, on top of saving space, also avoids confusion and mistakes). Many of the NPC rules work equally well for PCs, and those are the only cases where we cross those streams.

I can't find the rules for proficiencies for natural weapons. My instinct is to say they are "Unarmed", but I can make a case for dividing them between "Edged" and "Blunt".

How should they be handled? 

Natural attacks require the Unarmed proficiency.

[dorward]

Natural attacks require the Unarmed proficiency.

Thanks for the conformation

[MugMug]

"All natural attacks are Standard Unarmed Attacks except where noted" (pg 235). Sometimes a page reference is helpful for future questions.

Walter

[MugMug]

Are unarmed attacks a special type of melee attack (i.e. a melee attack made by a character wielding natural weapons)? In particular I'm trying to figure out whether Melee Attack Tricks (and, though I haven't really gotten around to it yet, Melee Combat Feats) are applicable to attacks using natural weapons.

Walter

[Crafty_Pat]

Are unarmed attacks a special type of melee attack (i.e. a melee attack made by a character wielding natural weapons)? In particular I'm trying to figure out whether Melee Attack Tricks (and, though I haven't really gotten around to it yet, Melee Combat Feats) are applicable to attacks using natural weapons.

They are not.

[MugMug]

They are not.

I came back to retract the question and saw it had already been answered. Shove (Melee or Unarmed Attack Trick) made the answer obviously "no," otherwise both wouldn't have been mentioned. Thanks, though!

Walter

[MugMug]

Somewhat related, the Drake's breath weapon appears to be the equivalent of the NPC Extraordinary Attack (Dmg 2; Alt Dmg: Fire; Beam 20ft). Page 237 suggests this would be considered a Standard Ranged Attack. Is there a particular proficiency that applies to this attack?

Walter

[Crafty_Pat]

Somewhat related, the Drake's breath weapon appears to be the equivalent of the NPC Extraordinary Attack (Dmg 2; Alt Dmg: Fire; Beam 20ft). Page 237 suggests this would be considered a Standard Ranged Attack. Is there a particular proficiency that applies to this attack?

No. It's something they're born with or grow into. They're assumed to use it without penalty and no one can take it from them.

[Rhishisikk]

They're assumed to use it without penalty and no one can take it from them.

Yeah, noticed that.  It's too bad that Called Shots and Cheap Shots can't target natural weapons.  I suppose I can still modify the DND:2E:Council of Wyrms:Dragonslayer class if drakes are as annoying as I fear they are.  Hm...  anyone done a study of monks?  Was there some kind of 'monk-hunter' in asian history/mythology?

[Desertpuma]

Not really ...

When 100 Shaolin monks responded to a civilian uprising of a few thousand people and defeated the riot by using their unarmed fighting abilities, the Emperor was horrified and attempted to kill them all by attacking their monastery burning it to the ground.

[MugMug]

No. It's something they're born with or grow into. They're assumed to use it without penalty and no one can take it from them.

Okay, one more proficiency slot to play with. Since natural attacks use the Unarmed proficiency I wanted to make sure I wasn't missing anything. Thanks!

Walter

[Dhampire]

Are unarmed attacks a special type of melee attack (i.e. a melee attack made by a character wielding natural weapons)? In particular I'm trying to figure out whether Melee Attack Tricks (and, though I haven't really gotten around to it yet, Melee Combat Feats) are applicable to attacks using natural weapons.

They are not.

I'll probably have a house rule in my games to allow Bite, Claw, Gore, and Talon natural attacks to use Melee Attack Tricks.

I think a Drake could probably make a Ragged Wound.

[Morgenstern]

Teeth like Daggers, Claws like Swords [Melee Combat Feat]
Your natural arsenal is to be feared as much as any blade.
Prerequisites: Natural attack (Bite or Claws)
Benefit: You may treat your bite and claw attacks as if they were edged melee attacks instead of unarmed attacks. You also gain a melee attack trick.

That work for you? Making it a melee feat represents training to do so rather than an innate change in your sharp bits. Plus melee feats tend to empower the tricks you are likely to employ after getting this feat .

[Dhampire]

Yes, that makes sense.