"Hey GC. ...Are drugs considered a poison?"

[TheTSKoala]

This.. this is what I get blind sided with as one of our players has to roll a new char.  (Word of Advice.  If you're going to do high speed chases on a major Highway.. and you're ballsy enough to try a head-on PIT manuever, don't roll a 2 with no Action Dice to spend...)

So.. of course.. I look up from my XP calculations and ask, "Huh?"

To which.. he lays out his new idea for a Char.  Jamacian hustler / spy who uses drugs to daze, taint and disable his opponents.  ...the curious GC in me asks.. "Such as?"  The answer was.. anything from pharmacy meds to aerisol Cocaine. 

Well.. right away.. I just shoot my head and commented about if he wears a Scarecrow mask and starts flinging playing cards at people... I was killing him off.     Everyone laughed.  But.. he does have a valid concept.. and an interesting one at that.  Now.. my question is.. does Pharmacology and Illicit Street Narcotics fall under the realm of poisons in the way of game mechanics?

[Krensky]

For what he wants to them, I'd say they do. Just for the effects. As for recreational use, I'm not sure off the top of my head if SC has an addiction mechanic. If it doesn't, I'm sure one of the SRDs has one we can crib.

[TheTSKoala]

Secondary question:

I don't have my books with me right now.  (They're upstairs in the office..)  Did the Crafty-Ones ever stat out the effects of drugs? 

[MilitiaJim]

Secondary question:

I don't have my books with me right now.  (They're upstairs in the office..)  Did the Crafty-Ones ever stat out the effects of drugs? 

I can't speak with authority, but I suspect they were deliberately omitted, and not forgotten.  Also, some drugs can be tricky.  What ramps most people up can knock some others out. 

[TheTSKoala]

Yeah.. I thought as much.. so.. my theory is.. peer some Fort Saves to various conditions and make some.. play as you go narcotic rules.

Like.. LSD.  Fort 16 vs. Fixated, Frightened, Reeling.  ..or.. something.  Looks like I have some GC work to do.

[MilitiaJim]

What about simple uppers like cocaine, and some harder stuff like PCP?  Aren't there rules for getting drunk?  Those might be a good start point.

[Gentry]

followed by the fatigued, exhausted, vulnerable, or even reeling conditions. Forced reeling feels like a nice and nasty come-down effect.

[TheAuldGrump]

And a lot of drugs are more lethal to those who have not built up a tolerance, and frequently to those who have lost their tolerance. A goodly number of people are killed each year when they go back to a drug that they had given up, and try taking the same size dose that they could handle back when it was a regular habit.

As an aside - historical games can run against modern sensibilities in this regard. Cocaine was available over the counter in the 1920, as was morphine. The Nazis made use of methamphetamine for their soldiers, which would have left them with habits after the war. The British controlled, but did not outlaw, the opium trade in China (and fought several wars over it, trying to keep their monopoly, under the banner of free trade.)

Wounded veterans almost always became dependent on the morphine and cocaine that was used to repress the pain of their injuries, Cough syrups often contained addictive drugs, and by now, everyone knows about Coca Cola (which eventually replaced cocaine with caffeine, which is less dangerous, but every bit as addictive.

And heroine was invented as a less addictive replacement for cocaine....

The Auld Grump, that which does not kill us can still make us stupider....

[Crafty_Pat]

does Pharmacology and Illicit Street Narcotics fall under the realm of poisons in the way of game mechanics?

Yes. We did indeed deliberately omit them from Spycraft 2.0 for a couple reasons - chiefly that the game was produced by a company that didn't allow drug use in its games. I imagine that we'll develop official drug rules for 10kB.

[Krensky]

Coca Cola (which eventually replaced cocaine with caffeine, which is less dangerous, but every bit as addictive.

Coca-cola always had caffeine. The cola in it's name comes from the kola nut extract. Coca-cola was developed after John Pemberton's county passed prohibition laws as a non-alchoholic version of Pemberton's French Wine Coca. In 1904 Coca-cola switched from using fresh coca leaves to "spent" leaves, and currently uses cocaine free coca leaf extract prepared by the Stephan Company at their Mayfield, New Jersey plant, the sole legal importer and processor of coca in the US. The cocaine is sold to Mallinckrodt Incorporated, the sole legal supplier of cocaine and derivatives in the US.

[TheTSKoala]

does Pharmacology and Illicit Street Narcotics fall under the realm of poisons in the way of game mechanics?

Yes. We did indeed deliberately omit them from Spycraft 2.0 for a couple reasons - chiefly that the game was produced by a company that didn't allow drug use in its games. I imagine that we'll develop official drug rules for 10kB.

Now that I think of it... just a quirky legal / diplomatic question.  Crafty probably has fans 'down under'.  Any concern with 10kb and the OFLC?

[TheAuldGrump]

Coca Cola (which eventually replaced cocaine with caffeine, which is less dangerous, but every bit as addictive.

Coca-cola always had caffeine. The cola in it's name comes from the kola nut extract. Coca-cola was developed after John Pemberton's county passed prohibition laws as a non-alchoholic version of Pemberton's French Wine Coca. In 1904 Coca-cola switched from using fresh coca leaves to "spent" leaves, and currently uses cocaine free coca leaf extract prepared by the Stephan Company at their Mayfield, New Jersey plant, the sole legal importer and processor of coca in the US. The cocaine is sold to Mallinckrodt Incorporated, the sole legal supplier of cocaine and derivatives in the US.

By 1929 the amount of Coca in the Cola had dropped to very nearly nil - according to Snopes about 1/400th of a grain per ounce of syrup. 1929 is when they stopped using the unspent leaves. (At one time Coca Cola was the largest importer of Coca leaves in the country, at least legally.) The founder of the company was under the impression that he had to maintain some amount of cocaine to continue using the trade name.

The amount of caffeine has also dropped over time for many beverages, though with 'energy drinks' this has climbed back up again. Back in the long ago Dr. Pepper included vitamin C rather than caffeine, earning it a slogan of 'Liquid Sunshine'. (That's what I always think when I see a glass of fizzy brown liquid, yesiree Bob! ) I was conflating Coca Cola and Dr. Pepper in my head last night, it was the good Dr. that added caffeine after dropping another ingredient (the vitamin C is now a thing of the past).

The Auld Grump

[Mister Andersen]

Potentially -- there were forced to rewrite Fallout 3 for distribution here to remove the names of the drugs the character uses because we don't have an adult classification for computer games here and due to the way our laws are structured all it takes is one fucktard State Atorney-General from South Australia to stop everyone else from introducing one.

Literature tends however to get a far greater leeway. At worst you might end up seeing 10KB sold in plastic wrap much as the Tzimisce splat blook was depending on how anal retentive the current censors are.

[Wolverine]

Crafty probably has fans 'down under'.  Any concern with 10kb and the OFLC?

As long as you bring enough for everyone, we won't complain

The only problems I remember having with RPG's was when Most Wanted came out. Ahh, good times.

[Crafty_Pat]

The only problems I remember having with RPG's was when Most Wanted came out. Ahh, good times.

I am not familiar with this story. Care to elaborate?