Aeropulp

[MilitiaJim]

Still, noby said we could not "reinvent" the Aeropulp subgenre, right? 

I think we can get it done.  One of the things I recall from an interview with one of the Crimson Skies guys, and feel free to correct me if I hallucinated/dreamed the whole thing, is that they started with deciding where they wanted the game world to be.  In the case of Crimson Skies it was a Balkanized North America.

So, obviously we want dogfights and crazy brawls and a complete lack of "no smoking" signs on our zepplins.  I wouldn't object to adding in some elements of warring rail lines as well, though you would need a completely disintegrated government before trains can use artillery on each other.

South America, Brazil in particular, would seem an excellent place for an aeropulp setting, especially back between WWI & WWII, plenty of open space where zepplins really are the only long haul option.  But why would everyone be down in the Amazon?

[foproy]

oil. a lot of the rain forest areas have oil. maybe an alternate history where south American oil interest are under attack. ok so what i completely stole the idea from mercs 2, it could work.not to mention panama, with the canal being a major international shipping line.

[MilitiaJim]

Mid jungle drilling and refining rigs, oil shipped out to the coast by zepplin, guarded by barnstormers seeking adventure.  Don't forget the rough dudes on the rigs, you can do some damage with a pipe wrench, nevermind the gear you need to keep the jungle at bay.

[Bill Whitmore]

I am really interested in this idea.  I need to come back when I have more time and start brainstorming some ideas.

[foproy]

glad i could help.

[foproy]

rebel pilots, air pirates flying giant zeppelins with their colors on the sides heck during WWI the Germans experimented with launching plains from airships.

[Krensky]

Set it in Europe in the late 1945 or so.

The USA never gets involved in WWI (although US citizens did as mercenaries and adventurers). The causes the Great War to drag out until it finally just fizzles out sometime around 1935 (historians are still arguing over the exact date) due to mutiny, dissertation, revolt, revolution and general weariness.

The Spanish Civil War is still ongoing, with the Monarchists holding off both the Communists and Fascists for the moment, France looses the Basque Country and Alsace. Germany breaks into three states, Italy fall back into various principalities, the Balkans remind everyone why their name is used for this. The Austria-Hungarian empire falls into ruin and local rule, the Ottoman Emipre disintegrates into tribal warfare, ethic massacre. Stalin was unable to smuggle Lenin out of Russia to Finland, and doesn't back down so Lenin, Stalin, and most of the Bolshevik party is slaughtered by the government's forces. Kerensky is still prime minister of the Russian Federation, fighting the both a Red and  White Russian insurgency. The Caucuses and the Ukraine break away from Russia, and ruled by Cossack warlords and a struggling Ukrainian Republic. Britain is largely untouched by this, although it has devolved central power in a manner analogous to the formation of the Commonwealth of Nations. The Holy See's power and influence grows as an island of stability. The US expands it's power and influence in the Western Hemisphere. The Nationalist and Maoist Chinese are still fighting, Japan is in Manchuria and snapping up former European colonies in the Pacific.

Main powers: The USA, The British Commonwealth, Russian Federation, Japanese Empire.

Intrigue in Continental Europe, adventures in Africa, Asia, South America, and Eastern Europe.

[Wolverine]

But why would everyone be down in the Amazon?

Aside from oil, lost cities and their treasures would also be a stong draw card. All it would take is one actual city being discovered to turn the area into the next gold rush. Plus, why spend weeks slogging through the jungle when you can simply fly over them.

[Txabier_Arrizotegui]

Main powers: The USA, The British Commonwealth, Russian Federation, Japanese Empire.

NAH! Not the US. If they did not get involved in the Great War, there's just no reason for them to be a world power (they became a wolrd power after WWII, basically because of their military and the A-bomb), so no... There has to be a reason for their being a power, espacially since their industrial power should underdeveloped in those years as their warmachine was not at full throttle.

If you go the TESLA-way, and let your imagination run wild, Lithium is a BIG thing anyone who wants to harness the Power Electric to make more advanced/compact electric generators. That's the other reason to be in Bolivia and the Amazon.

I'd also suggest that the timeline should be set no later than 1940, with the majority of the players you have mentioned, but not mixing so many factors (Maoist China still in turmoil is overdoing it... maybe a fractioned China, still having problems with the warlords, but not an ongoing revolution).

Spain with fascists is also overdoing it... Franco was inspired by Hilter, not Mussolinni, and his fascism came to light late in the war, at first he was a "monarchist" (but always a swine). A civil war where the people (Anarchists) are demanding reforms from the Monarchy is a more plausible scenario (seeing that the Bolchevik revolution has not triumphed yet, thus giving no real basis for a "communist"block helping in the war).

I mean, big plot area interesting, but too much of everything in any mix will always end in chaos.

Besides I'm seeing a strong "anti-commie" sentiment here and yet another "purely imperialist" setting where only the western powers are the good guys is just that... yet another version of the same, revised thing.

[Mister Andersen]

The world of Crimson Skies

[MilitiaJim]

Besides I'm seeing a strong "anti-commie" sentiment here ...

You say that like it's a bad thing.   

The geopolitical realignment that would come from the US not entering WWI is interesting and useful.  Zepplins crossing between small countries with their fortified borders.  But zepplins are expensive, and you really need something more than robbing other zepplins to cover expenses.  (Check some out here.)  European governments could probably keep rogue zepplins under enough control to make pulp "impractical."  Some more musing on things changing if the US stays out will now happen as I drive to work.

China would still be a warlord infested place, pretty ideal for pulp adventures really, even if you're just talking about the gunboats on the Yangtze in the 30s.

[Krensky]

Main powers: The USA, The British Commonwealth, Russian Federation, Japanese Empire.

NAH! Not the US. If they did not get involved in the Great War, there's just no reason for them to be a world power (they became a wolrd power after WWII, basically because of their military and the A-bomb), so no... There has to be a reason for their being a power, espacially since their industrial power should underdeveloped in those years as their warmachine was not at full throttle.

The US has been a world power since the at least the Spanish American war. We didn't become a super power until after WWII, but then again neither did anyone else. The USA industrial capacity wasn't ran at full throttle for the non-existent WWII, but it had been worked pretty good selling goods and supplies of all sorts to whoever showed up with cash. Most industrialized economies in Europe were destroyed by The War and The Great Depression. It's a case of last man standing. Also, a more revisionist view of the Monroe Doctrine leads to more influence and direct control of places in Latin America, and greater tension with the British Commonwealth over it's Caribbean and Canadian territories.

I'd also suggest that the timeline should be set no later than 1940, with the majority of the players you have mentioned, but not mixing so many factors (Maoist China still in turmoil is overdoing it... maybe a fractioned China, still having problems with the warlords, but not an ongoing revolution).

1940 would be fine, especially since I typoed the end of The Great War (it should be between 1925 or 1930). In either of these time lines, the KMT and CPC would still be fighting each other and Japan. The Chinese civil war did not end in the real war until 1949 (and you could argue it still hasn't ended).

Spain with fascists is also overdoing it... Franco was inspired by Hilter, not Mussolinni, and his fascism came to light late in the war, at first he was a "monarchist" (but always a swine). A civil war where the people (Anarchists) are demanding reforms from the Monarchy is a more plausible scenario (seeing that the Bolchevik revolution has not triumphed yet, thus giving no real basis for a "communist"block helping in the war).

Franco was inspired by neither. Franco made the Carlists and Falange  play nice and led them and the Army. The fascism in Spain comes from the Falange, who were inspired by Mussoili. A civil war between Nationalists (led by Primo de Rivera and his son), the Carlists (led by Manuel Fal Conde and Javier de Borbón), and the Popular Front is perfectly workable, and possible. If you insist on Franco being involved, he'd be a Nationalist General. Or better yet, have him die in the early fighting and occasionally include a news story stating that General Franco is still dead.

Besides I'm seeing a strong "anti-commie" sentiment here and yet another "purely imperialist" setting where only the western powers are the good guys is just that... yet another version of the same, revised thing.

On one hand, welcome to the genre. Fascists and Communists are the villains in pulp. Deal with it.
On the other, just because the Bolsheviks lost, doesn't stop communism. Kerensky and the Russian Federation are Socialist, there are socialist and communist revolutionaries throughout Europe, Mao is still handing out his little red cookbook. And where did I paint anyone as a good guy?

[Mister Andersen]

It's actually really sad when you look at the history of Germany in the lead up to WWI, and think what might have been had the authoritarian (and almost Fascist) Chancellor Bismarck and the autocratic with a social conscience Kaiser Wilhem II actually managed to work together.

[TheAuldGrump]

It's actually really sad when you look at the history of Germany in the lead up to WWI, and think what might have been had the authoritarian (and almost Fascist) Chancellor Bismarck and the autocratic with a social conscience Kaiser Wilhem II actually managed to work together.

Willhelm had... problems. Way too prone to viewing the world as he wanted it to be, leading to such minor misunderstandings as WWI. (Of course they won't invade! They just want us as allies so they can use the threat of invasion! Let's go on a cruise....) There is also, if I recall correctly, some evidence that he was casting covetous eyes at what had been his grandmother's throne. Given that one of his complaints about Bismark was that the man (the Iron Chancellor!) was too much of a dove it seems likely that some other enveloping conflict would have been likely.

I would wonder instead what might have happened had Franz Ferdinand listened when advisors warned him about visiting Sarajevo. (Of all the members of that line that Princip could have chosen, Franz Ferdinand was the one that leaned toward increasing autonomy for satellite states.)

And remember boys and girls, when invading your neighbor it is a bad idea to do so over their artillery practice range.... O' ye gods and little fishes, WWI was a c*** up on so many levels. Much as I love reviewing the technological and tactical cusps that occurred it was an utter pooch screw.

The Auld Grump, who still wants to run a game set in a steampunk version of the war.

[Mister Andersen]

Oh, there's no doubt Wilhelm was messed in the head -- all that inbreeding amidst the European royals coupled with growing up as a cripple in Prussia will do that to you. Throw in the effects of British supremacy on that inferiority complex and you're just screwed.

And Bismarck was no dove. He was the man who had essentially been responsible for the creation of Germany as a nation state, and he first came into conflict with Wilhem over his plan to engineer a socialist uprising just so he'd have an excuse to ruthlessly exterminate the whole lot of them, a plan Wilhem put the kibosh on because he had no wish to begin his reign with a bloodbath of his own subjects. While Bismarck devoted himself to keeping peace in Europe --  after prosecuting the 1866 Austro-Prussian War and 1870 Franco-Prussian War, both of which which coincidentially greatly facilitated Italian unification -- he did so purely with the intent that the strength of the nascent German Empire would not be threatened. Interestingly, he had opposed the annexation of Alsaice-Lorraine, a loss that some 40 years later would come back to haunt Germany just as he feared it would.

The key problem lay in that they were both supreme meglomaniacs. Bismarck was convinced no one else was capable of looking after the new nation's interests and did his best to skew the sociopolitical and legal landscape to that end including controlling access to the Kaiser, while Wilhem (coached no less by Bismarck himself as a tool to that end) was of the mindset that he was ordained by god to rule supreme over his domain. Sadly for Bismarck, th ball in that respect was firmly in Willy's court as the constiutution meant that the Chancellor required the confidence of the Kaiser and not the Parliament to maintain his job. With Bismarck gone, Wilhelm was basically at the mercy of militarists and court intriguers who fed his desire for Germany to acquire and maintain its "place in the sun".

If they'd found common ground, I think they could have contained each other's extremes. Instead they essentially went out of their way to sabotage each other with the end result of the Fatherland's bollocks being put under the hammer.