Concealed Weapons VS Spot?

[Rekres]

A question came up during a game recently and we tried to find an answer.  The answer we think we found seems a little off...

When infiltrating a mansion to perform a mission, two of the characters had handguns concealed in jackets.  Regarding the security guards patting down the guests as they entered the mansion, what would be the modifiers for their Spot checks to notice the concealed handguns.

Looking at the table for size (it was either Tiny or Diminutive) we figured a +12 to concealment ... but that didn't seem quite right.  Would it be +12 versus a visual search, but how about a physical pat-down?

It didn't matter much in the session, because the one PC rolled a critical 1 to hide his weapon (and the other used the diversion to slip through unchecked)... but it might be nice to know for future sessions.

[Crafty_Pat]

The rules you want are in the Sleight of Hand/Stash Item check and Search/Perception check descriptions (see the Spycraft 2.0 Rulebook: First Printing, pages 159 and 156, respectively).

The short answer is yes, those numbers are right for those sizes, and there's no additional modifier for frisking. The GC could apply a discretionary modifier of -4 to +4, though, if he feels it's warranted.

[NezMaster]

What am I missing here...

A casual person with no skill picks up a small gun and slides into his shoulder holster under his jacket. He has no ranks in stash item, and no stat bonus. ok, i roll a 13..slightly above average.  Total = 13 + 12 =25...

A moderately trained security guard with no stat bonus and 4 ranks in the skill spends two minutes patting me down. (take 20 + 4= 24)..that doesn't strike you as..odd?

You'd think police would get shot alot more often in this case..

[Antilles]

That's easy... result caps. The guy stashing the weapon has a cap of 15, but the guy searching him has a cap of 30. That oughta tip the scales in the security guard's favour.

[Psion]

In part, I also sort of assume the frisking factors in a time modifier.

But I still think an additional modifier is warranted. I mean you can visually inspect someone in a non-official capacity (like undercover at a social event), but having someone physically contact your body which you would not be able to do should afford an additional modifier.