Your description also implies that SR has completely moved outside the Cyberpunk genre to become it's own thing, ignoring the implicit and often (from the character's perspective) unintentional revolutionary nature of the cyberpunk protagonist. 

There is less punk to it. I don't think much, and it is easy to put back in. There was a recent post about SR and Cyberpunk having such an 80s feel, but some of that is actually very cool. 80s Billy Idol would make for an awesome runner.

Implanted cellular decks mixed with Cybergenesk virtuality.  Bleh.  Sounds like they changed the decker into another flavor of mage.  So much for cyberpunk ambiance.  Part of that ambiance IS the Solos and other shooters pinned down by corp security, asking the Netrunner how much longer because, you know, there's a whole lot of boys in black and their radio chatter sounds like they just called for an AV-9 gunship and we really need this door open five minutes ago.... Followed by the 'runner, eyes still rolled back and mostly lost in the net, telling them to shut up, he's working.  That's the hard thing to capture.

The problem with the old versions is that each Matrix system was composed of various nodes. It was like a matrix dungeon. You got in the main door, sprung a trap, fought some ICE, went into another room, found some data, went into another room, fought some ICE, went into another room, found the controls for the cameras. All of that took an hour to run, while your team sat in the van, because otherwise they would be screwed. Then they went in while you sat there. And if something came up while on the run, everyone could go watch TV... that's not edge of your seat excitement. Now, the hacker can be in on the action and is literally in the corner behind the desk during the fight, dodging bullets while trying to get an overlay of the enemy team, cut off the enemy rigger from the enemy drones, crack and download the important file, and open that blast door. I like that a lot better, and the GM can really manage the action and excitement better.

http://www.worldworksgames.com/store/ - excellent 3-D paper terrain

Has anyone used it? They look cool, but sometimes I wonder if the height of many of the objects buildings is overkill and would actually clutter the game. (Players 1-3 can't see the fight due to tall buildings...). Also, is the larger size (it looks like Heroclix is the main mini concept) a problem?

Thanks,

Teos

But is Shatterpunk gonna address the VR metaverse speed of thought type hacking Gibson is known for?

That's been a big playability increase for SR4. A lot of old timers are still mulling the change over, but basically it means the hacker (decker in old SR versions) can now do everything on the fly. They walk with the team and do things like hack the security cameras and open doors and take out enemy team's cybereyes all while working with the team, instead of in a solo adventure that takes eons. That's one advantage of SR over Spycraft. In SR, the whole team gets to act all the time in most mod events.

Teos

Sorry to hear you did not like SR4. SR4 actually streamlines game play a fair amount. In previous editions you had to add up dice results. The newer system of all 5s and 6s being successes makes everything a lot simpler. Still, if you are in a D20 mindset and/or don't like dice pools, then sure, it seems rough. I would suggest not giving up on it too much - there are a lot of dice pool systems and SR4 is a great one, IMHO.

Shadowrun has always had an awesome knack for the ambiance of the game. The mood, tone, setting, etc. is just so cool. Actually, when it comes to SR4, that's my big pet peeve. Of all the editions, I find 4th to have the least to contribute to the setting. It probably is fine tone-wise for new players, but it seemed to add little for me (I've played all previous editions).

I play SR every other week. We run the living campaign, SR Missions. The mods are decent (a minor step below the LSpy mods, though I am playing the very first ones, which may improve) and do a fine job of walking players through the setting. They are free downloads at http://shadowrun4.com/missions/.

SR has, in many ways, sadly replaced my Spycraft games. Ideally, I would like to play both. In Portland I have found it very hard to recruit for Spycraft, though I still have high hopes. I think the cancellation of LSpy just killed the interest, since I have roughly the same number of players in my Yahoo groups but have no trouble getting a game going for SR.

They are very different games, and porting over the SR feel to the Spycraft rules is hard. If you want to do it, then that link posted to Jtraub's Cybercraft seems like a solid start, but the real key is to capture the overall setting. It is a back against the wall, no friends, haven't showered, rent's due, society is crumbling, I've sold my soul to drugs tech and rock, who do I have to gun for my next meal, etc. kind of setting. That's hard to capture, and that's what the SR 4 rules deliver.

Give it a second shot, if not just to get a better idea on how to work the concept into an SR game.

A suggestion, as well. Any new system that has a radically different approach (dice pools vs D20) seems daunting. A good way to get over the learning curve is to play a bunch of archetypes. Gather some friends and just hand them out randomly, then play a combat using some of the sample NPCs in the rulebook. Then play a different archetype. Once you see how a drone rigger and street shaman are similar, and how a mage and a street samurai are similar, the game gets much easier to run and to play. Two more tips, for what it is worth. Paint the 5s and 6s on your dice a bold color, and optionally the 1s for glitches. It makes it really easy to count successes. That tip and also some very useful cheat sheets for various archetypes are available at http://pavao.org/shadowrun/.

Now, this is a Spycraft board, so let me be positive. I love Spycraft. I think it is awesome. I thin Spycraft has a number of advantages over SR, particularly that I personally like the D20ish system better. I also like level-based progression vs all PCs being basically the same and buying various improvement aspects (as in SR). I really like the dramatic conflicts. I really like the cinematic angle, which really works well with the D20 changes Crafty made (I can try to replicate it with other systems, but somehow the Spycraft rules just work with the cinematic style).

All I need is a living system and I'm sure I would be playing it every other week. 

Now back to working on my Shadowrun drone rigger-rocker... 

Teos

Following our recent tangent, I recently purchased "Flatlands: Modern Tiles and Tokens Megaset" (http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/product_info.php?products_id=3215&it=1).

It provides some cutouts and tokens as minis, which are ok (I'm not a big fan of paper minis), but what I really like are the car cutouts and other props (tables, chairs, office equipment, closed circuit cameras, etc.). The cars are great for spycraft, including several vans and jeeps and hummer-types, plus two choppers.

There are also some pretty good tiles. With time and cash for a nice print job, the tile sets could be made into some cool ways to run mods (sort of the way dungeon tiles are uses in D&D), but the vehicles are what I really dug.

They work well for Shadowrun or other more future settings as well.

Teos

Works for me!

Salsa, one thing to keep in mind is that wording on the Final Attacks. A Final Attack cannot trigger another attack. So, you have to keep that in mind when using any feats that would do that. For example, you might be careful to not use a Final Attack on a mook that is already wounded if you are planning on using the feat Snap Shot. You can also do things like split your initiative and use a Press action if you have a high enough initiative.

Still, it is relatively easy to find feats that do work, such as Contempt (such a great name). Freight-Train (my Soldier6/triggerman1) can basically clean a room of all mooks with his attacks. I think I shot 7 times in one round at Gencon and could have probably taken another two shots if more foes had been in that room.

Also, consider the very useful Surge of Speed to get yourself into place so that you can actually take a significant number of attacks. Surge of Speed can open the door or move you into the main room so that every round counts.

Teos

Question: I am assuming that tricks like Disrupting Shot (free action) still use the underlying action (Tire is a half-action)? Correct? (Seems too strong otherwise).

Teos

I think, Pneumonica, that I just have a different take on things. I think PCs need to decide what they are good and bad at. And being bad at combat of one form or another (or both forms) is viable. It can be totally cool to play a pointman that barks out commands from under a desk - they are probably working on something else under the desk anyway... or the faceman that does the same. I read over the various requirements, and I don't see them as limiting in any way. What they do is add some strength to builds that might otherwise be weak. When you want to be a bit of both things, like a Faceman who can fight in melee, these tricks allow you to make a minimal investment in STR and gain the benefits of Charisma for melee attack (for example). That takes a concept that was fairly weak before (+1 to melee attacks) and makes it viable. Way cool.

Teos

It's a very useful article. I passed it on to my Oregon list, so maybe it will help some folks take the step of creating a character. 

It does a nice job of showing how different classes can cover various bases with possessions, while still having some good creative flair. There's a thing or two there for the more advanced players too.

Now, I don't agree that this somehow simplifies the gear system. I await the latest printing with bated breath, but as I've said before, gear is still both one of the coolest elements of the game and also the stumbling block.

Teos

(as most self respecting attribute score whores will have an 18)

Hey, my character was just born that way! *SNIFF* *SNIFF*

Yeah, ok. You win! *raises fist to heavens*

Teos

I know, I know. I'm just having a brute of a time recruiting players for Spycraft in Oregon since the LSpy announcement. Trying for a game this week... we shall see.

On topic, the Miss Moneypenny interaction was always an awesome part of the series. And she really nailed the role. I mean... 

Teos

Cool! That's actually even better than I thought it worked.

Now I just need to revise my tables, in case I ever convince people to play LSpy again.

Teos

Word on the street is that someone told her LSpy was ending...

The way I read it, which seems simple, is that you ignore that many range penalties. So, if you ignore range penalty 2, then you would ignore the first two penalties. Once you get to the third range increment, you would apply the penalty for being one range increment out of your normal (expanded) range.

Weapon has 20' increments. Telescopic sight ignoring 2 range increments.
- shoot target at 15' = no penalty
- 35' = no penalty
- 41' = counts as first range increment.

Also, don't forget to track CQB and laser sight ranges. Those penalties can be the bigger loss for some PCs. For my two-weapon pistol Triggerman, I have written down different "stat blocks" for each of the potential ranges and for different caliber mission picks (at high calibers, I have the telescopic sights and sometimes the threaded barrel with extension). This becomes really hard to track on the fly.

Teos